who wants to be thai ?

Post by **papafarang** » March 13, 2016, 4:34 am

a spill over from another thread, just wondering how many members would give up their foreign passports, pensions and rights from their home countries , or would advise their children to take full thai citizenship ? for instance i'm British, which means I get all the benefits of pension, free healthcare, a social security system, higher quality education system, democratic rights and easy access to travel around to most countries around the world, I also have the right to reside and work in most other European countries. and the benefit of having a thai passport is what exactly ??

Post by **jai yen yen** » March 13, 2016, 6:11 am

I am proud to be a Canadian and would never give up my citizenship for any other especially for a country like Thailand with so many human rights abuses and lack of freedom. My Issan born Thai wife loves Canada because she is treated fairly by everyone, no Hiso snobs here. As well the privilages we have as to health care, pensions and general security are priceless.

Post by **Khun Paul** » March 13, 2016, 6:14 am

While the thought of obtaining a Thai passport as well as an ID card can bring benefits I am sure the fact that you have made a conscious decision to disown the country of your birth could have far reaching effects. Your pension will still be paid as your tax if you are in a Government pension scheme .
The downside for not changing is,I see it is the constant 3 monthly jaunts to the Immigration Police, the application for a yearly visa, the out-right racism and double standards in this country , the inability to secure lifelong accommodation as well as being unable to own it unless you are married and even then there are catches.

Taking all that into account and being British...... I will keep the freedoms I enjoy , the ease of travel, and even though my country is notoriously bad in looking after expats, I prefer them to the Government here by a long way.
One could say then why am I here, the usual reasons but as one gets older it is the warmth of the weather and even the people, NOW with greater accessibility to foods I enjoy and loved for years, life is truly acceptable.

I will saty as I am, there are those who perceive that a change will benefit them, up to them of course but change nationality, NO-WAY. I am a proud slightly eccentric Englishman.

Post by **GT93** » March 13, 2016, 7:02 am

Given the nationalities of the vast majority of readers of this forum, I'd be surprised if anyone answered other than no way.

A more interesting version of this question might be, what if Thai nationality was the only way you could live in Thailand? In other words, you needed to abandon your citizenship and become Thai to stay in Thailand. Would you stay? I don't think there would be many long noses left in Thailand.

However many Lao, Burmese and Cambodians might happily be Thai as it's probably a ticket to a way better life. More than a few million Syrians, Libyans, Iranians, Iraqis, North Koreans etc. might also become Thai if they had the choice. Thailand and being Thai is far from the bottom of the barrel.

Post by **papafarang** » March 13, 2016, 8:22 am

"Thailand and being Thai is far from the bottom of the barrel." very true GT, there's probably 120+ other countries where you would not like to have a passport to.

Post by **fatbob** » March 13, 2016, 8:39 am

Dual citizenship and holding a Thai passport would be appealing but I would never hand my Aussie passport in, however if I was a Pom I wouldn't hesitate....

Post by **GT93** » March 13, 2016, 9:19 am

Stirrer. At least you didn't mention the Queen of Australia or the Germans as I did on Xmas Day.

Post by **papaguido** » March 13, 2016, 9:01 pm

ezrider wrote:this question is off post subject but does anyone know the current laws pertaining to foreign/Thai males turning 18yrs. of age regarding being drafted into Thai army or having to choose one citizenship over another? Of course laws could change in 6 yrs. My son, age 12, holds both passports now. Thanks.

First off, the age of consent is 20. Conscription is not set in stone. I looked it up a while back when my stepson turned 20. There are a number of ways to get a deferment from military service, but if needed they can be called to service.

1. Medical
2. Cadet training in high school (I think the student has to complete 3yrs of cadet training).
3. College

As for citizenship, it's summed up well here...

mr passout wrote:Thaksin and Abbishit both have Dual Citizenship as do plenty of Thai actors and Doctors and politicians and so on.
I think it depends on how they interprete the law.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/883 ... d-allowed/
For those with half Thai children the Act provides for them to surrender Thai nationality on a voluntary basis between their 20th and 21st birthday. Many government officials will tell you it is compulsory for them to surrender Thai nationality at that point (and may wish it were so), if they wish to retain their foreign nationality, but that is simply not what the law says, nor how it is interpreted in practice. The Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs is fully supportive of dual nationality and will give every assistance to half Thais living abroad. In fact they seem to encourage them to take up and maintain their Thai nationality in addition to the nationality of the country where they reside. The MoFA states clearly on its website that dual nationality is neither expressly allowed or prohibited under Thai law and that whether you can hold dual nationality or not depends only on whether the other country prohibits it or not. It even provides instructions to dual Thai nationals as to how juggle passports when travelling.

Anyway that's my bit,please don't shoot the messenger.

Post by **FrazeeDK** » March 13, 2016, 11:36 pm

as to gaining Thai citizenship it is a long and arduous procedure. First you must gain Permanent Residency. To my recollection the Thai government officially allows only a limited number of expatriates to gain permanent residency each year. After getting Permanent Resident status you can then later apply for Citizenship which requires near fluency in Thai and an interview with government officials.. AS noted above foreigners can retain dual citizenship if allowed by their original country of citizenship. However, each country may have different rules regarding old age pensions or government pensions being stopped if you gain citizenship in another country.

gaining Permanent Residency:

https://www.justlanded.com/english/Thai ... -residence

Gaining Thai Citizenship:

https://www.justlanded.com/english/Thai ... itizenship

Post by **papafarang** » March 14, 2016, 4:21 am

so the only clear benefits of holding a thai passport . no visa issues , own land ,and if young enough join the army and earn 9,000 baht a month, which of course meant you would never be able to afford land. and get a 500b a month pension
so it would be good for people who come from Somalia then but bad for the rest of us.
seems my young friend who decided to keep his American citizenship made the right choice then.

Post by **maaka** » March 14, 2016, 5:44 am

what about this new ASEAN thingy..does that give Thai the right to work in other Asian countries, and other rights there?

Post by **Khun Paul** » March 14, 2016, 6:54 am

papafarang wrote:so the only clear benefits of holding a thai passport . no visa issues , own land ,and if young enough join the army and earn 9,000 baht a month, which of course meant you would never be able to afford land. and get a 500b a month pension
so it would be good for people who come from Somalia then but bad for the rest of us.
seems my young friend who decided to keep his American citizenship made the right choice then.

After attempting to gain a visa for, my then wife to VISIT the UK some years ago which was successful I hasten add ( now I understand it is even harder ) any nationality which allows ease of travel to almost any country has got to be the better choice , notwithstanding the benefits of staying Thai ( possibly ) , the downsides are minimal considering the costs , the interviews and even other problems associated to be another nationality not Western or First world country.

Post by **bumper** » March 14, 2016, 5:22 pm

Residency would be good, citizenship, what for?

14 years now and I don't think like a Thai and probably never will. I respect how they live their lives. It is simply not for me, my wife afraid of the authority of a Security Guard cause he has a uniform. I'm not afraid of authority. I'
m willing to go to court is need be. I have in the past and I won.

It is difficult adjustment when you first n move here, I have dine very well here. But i's because of my retirement from the states. Not what I have earned here which is nothing. Bot I would like to live in a cooler climate. If Mexico would settle down I would sale off and be living in Rosaritea Beach> I doubt the drug pipeline will change any time soon.

one lace I resea4ched years ago was Hondourous a friend went to live there said it was just to dangerous

My retirement is enough to live in the States. But, not on the level I do here.

Take away the heat and this would be a perfect place for me. But, I don't need to be a citizen to enjoy it. There are areas of China that are cool this time of year. But. not system I want to live in.

Old age pension here is 500 baht I believe. That is far less then most of live on here. So why put it at risk for a different passport. I don't mind visiting them every 90 days . sorry got off subject here. The simple answer is no. For all the reasons stated

Post by **ezrider** » March 14, 2016, 8:10 pm

The Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs is fully supportive of dual nationality and will give every assistance to half Thais living abroad. In fact they seem to encourage them to take up and maintain their Thai nationality in addition to the nationality of the country where they reside.

Right, but what if they want to remain in Thailand, not abroad?

Post by **papafarang** » March 14, 2016, 10:47 pm

interesting question ez, if he keeps duel is he still eligible for conscription ? or would he be exempt ? or would he have to go to his other country when he's coming up to 21 ?

Post by **GT93** » March 15, 2016, 2:17 am

A Chulalongkorn University professor writes about the dimming of Thailand's star:

"Thailand's descent from a global beacon of democratisation to a regional laggard under military-authoritarian rule naturally depresses its own people more than others."

A link to the article can be found at the end of Stickman's column this week or probably through google.

Post by **FrazeeDK** » March 15, 2016, 3:25 am

If a dual national child is registered in their district at age 18 they are required to register for military conscription. If overseas I believe they are obligated to go to the nearest Thai diplomatic mission. At age 21 unless deferred or given credit for reserve training/service from school they are required to present themselves for lottery conscription in the district where they are registered. There, they will go through a nearly day long ordeal of paperwork, physical examination, classification and finally the Red or Black ball picked from a jar to determine if you go or are free..

On the question of a dual national Thai getting out of the draft I've seen discussions indicating if the draftee does not speak Thai they cannot be inducted.. I've also seen discussions where it was said that the military won't take a dual-national even if they speak Thai...

Post by **papafarang** » March 15, 2016, 6:38 am

actually it's not as bad as expected, I spoke to someone yesterday who's friends son had to go through the process, the odds are actually in your favor as most places are taken up by volunteers, in his district they had so many people opt to join that no one had to do the lottery , in fact some that did want to join couldn't as the district quota was already filled. so I had a read on the internet and it turns out that the chances of being conscripted is only a few % to sometimes 0%. mind you the few that are conscripted can't be happy about it

Post by **FrazeeDK** » March 15, 2016, 7:52 am

my great-nephew stood the lottery in Khumpawapi back a couple of years ago.. As near as we could determine about 4 in 10 had to go.. As mentioned each district has a quota. If that district has enough enlistees and if other districts in the Province or even other provinces has a high level of enlistees the odds get better still While he was standing in the hall in the Khumpawapi District government area waiting, he was told that he could be guaranteed getting a non-select by paying 5000 baht... That probably has gone away with the government anti-corruption drive.. Lucky him though, he selected the right ball and got a walk... He'd gotten a one year deferment for being in Tech College and I wondered why the Thai military didn't encourage such graduates to enlist...

here's a Reuters story on the Thai draft from 2013.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-thail ... 2N20130410

Post by **Hoopoe** » March 15, 2016, 10:59 am

papafarang wrote:a spill over from another thread, just wondering how many members would give up their foreign passports, pensions and rights from their home countries , or would advise their children to take full thai citizenship ? for instance i'm British, which means I get all the benefits of pension, free healthcare, a social security system, higher quality education system, democratic rights and easy access to travel around to most countries around the world, I also have the right to reside and work in most other European countries. and the benefit of having a thai passport is what exactly ??

free health care ??????? if you have permanently been here over 12 months i think you'll find your free health care has taken a ---- , Expats outside of Europe get charged for health care in the UK