New International School Coming to Udon?

[amazonboy]

I got an email back from Lindsay this morning... Fees for pre school will start at approx 200,000 baht rising to 290,000 baht. You can register from January.

At this price for a brand new unknown school in Isan with school future unpredictable, quality unpredictable, I really doubt this school can make it. It may take 10 years or more to establish itself to justify this price. I don't think many
expats or Thais will risk and pay this price which is more than many many very well established schools in Malaysia,
Singapore, or in other Thailand cities.

At this price for a completely unknown school, I am sure it won't attract any Lao expats, because we can easily put
them in the best international schools in Vientiane at this price range. As far as I know, these super rich Thais in Udon Isan, many send their kids to international schools in Bangkok, also to Malaysia, Singapore. My kids' school in Penang has quite a few Thai kids from Khon Kaen, Udon and other Isan cities. And the school is very established with all kids speak only English on campus, no mother tongue on campus whatever it is, and I pay less tuition there than this new proposed rate from this unknown entity.

Well. I will keep my kids in Penang for another while, will not risk this high price for a completely unknown school.

[nel123]

Hi Amazon... I take it that's a boarding school? That's something I wouldn't be keen on doing either, can't see the point in having kids if they are shipped off somewhere. Each to they're own i suppose.

[amazonboy]

I take it that's a boarding school? That's something I wouldn't be keen on doing either,

No, this is the school fee without boarding. I think Udon Inter school does not have boarding. In Penang, KL, Singapore, tons of wives stay there with kids going to international schools, while husbands work in various places in Asia, particularly China, Thailand, India, Myanmar, ect ect, as for me, my wife stay with kids in Penang, and I work in Laos, many Lao expats put their kids and wife in Singapore and Malaysia for the quality of school and quality of life at reasonable price, Singapore for the richer ones.

There are lots of rich Thais kids going to school in Penang, some stay with mother while father come visit them
time to time(many own condos there ), some appoint local guardians, some stay in school dorms. My kids' school has some rich Isan kids from khon Kaen and Udon and they all own nice beach condos.

I really don't know at this high tuition fee, how big a market it will be in Udon Thani, because it will not attract customers from other regions or from across the border, Thai Isan families that can afford this probably have condos or houses in Bangkok already, probably more likely to send kids to Bangkok or overseas, i am pretty sure this new entity will really struggle in the beginning,

[writemotive]

I will approach the new school with an open mind, and do my own due diligence. It is very conveniently located to our home and if it checks out, offers a good education for the price, I'm in...

[Khun Paul]

Not much can go wrong with youngsters and at that price I would expect superb teaching, however having seen the requirement for Thai assistant teachers, one of the qualities needed was for Thai teachers to be able to inspire their students to learn. As yet that quality is missing from most I have seen, so the list of prospective teachers will be very short I think. Also if the price for the little ones is 25k odd a month what will it be for the bigger children, that thought does not even bear thinking about.

[KHONDAHM]

Ok, ok, I know everyone is holding their breath just waiting for KD to weigh in on this new development (ha! not!).

My trepidation with "international schools" here in Thailand is that they over-promise and under-deliver. At any price. I have dealt with enough of them to be able to say with confidence that they are more same-same until/unless they can prove otherwise. Reports of how nice or new the school is, or how many foreign teachers they employ, or even how happy the kids seem means nothing. My Precious was very happy in her (then) new school in part because all they did was watch DVDs of Harry Potter and whatnot all day in an air conditioned classroom on a big new TV while the foreign teachers took the day off or otherwise were not tending to the business of educating the children.

As anyone who has followed my posts in the Udon Thani Schools thread knows, she's now ranked #1 in Udon/Isaan and scores 90%+ on the USA standardized exams I give her each week. She goes to public school (for socialization) and I homeschool her weeknights (when needed) and weekends (although not as much now that she's "got it"). So, we are proof that one does not NEED an international school to achieve international standards. One just needs to be a vested and participating parent.

That said, it would be a good thing for my son if I could find a real school with real teachers using a real curriculum. Something along the lines as what was discussed and presented at length in the Udon Schools thread, including the document of the vision I created and uploaded. I don't honestly think a pre-K to P2 education is worth 200k+ baht/year because those are pretty much mostly the playtime years. By the same token, I might pay that much for my son to have "quality" friends rather than the village knuckleheads we have around us. If I were to send my son there at age 4, it would be for the friends.

All that said, so far it sounds like the school is going after the bucks first and foremost. I do believe there are enough wealthy locals (Thais) who would without a doubt turn the place into just another "prestige" destination for their kids. Most of us should be able to recall Don Boscoe, St. Mary's, etc. and how they went from a place to get a good education to just a name for sale. My daughter bests all of them; and that proves (to me) more than anything how relatively worthless they have become as institutions of learning. I have no interest in joining the locals (Thais) in putting my son there just because I can. We expats don't give a rats xxs about keeping up with the Jonesaporns. We want and demand a good education - not a name. I would hope whoever is running the show there is keenly aware of how catering only to the wealthier families will eventually ruin their vision (if it exists) of providing a great education.

For example: Will they actually fail students who do not perform or just pass them along for as long as the invoices are paid? Will they actually objectively qualify students before acceptance or will they just accept any who can pay the bill and then place the slow with the advanced learners? After acceptance, how will they encourage the advanced students to learn at a faster pace, or will they make the advanced students slow down or "help" the slow students? What are the teacher qualifications? I too received a reply and so far it sounds like they will employ anyone with a degree and who has passed the teaching test (whatever that is). That gets the teacher hired, but it doesn't even come close to meaning that hired person is a real teacher (!). I would need to see that the teachers are REAL teachers with verifiable long track records teaching at the grammar school grade levels. Anything and everything else means beans to me. I don't care how nice they seem or how sharply they dress or how well they speak. Show me their records - and it had better be impressive for that kind of money to teach a post-toddler.

[I will tell you right now: If I am paying that kind of money, they damn well had better be encouraging my son to learn more and not hold him back because the other students can't keep up (!). I mean, let's be real: If a professional teacher's salary (Filipina, for example) is 20k/month, then what each parent is paying is more than the salary of a private teacher for the entire year (!) EXCEPT that the otherwise private teacher is teaching a LOT more students. So, if the tuition is more than the salary of such a teacher, then I rightfully should expect the quality of his education to be nothing less than what he would get from having a private teacher...or so help me, I would be better off bringing my own over from the Philippines and paying for everything myself.

I digress...]

While I understand bills need to be paid, I would be much more interested in a school that SCREENS children before accepting and accepts only the brightest rather than just any who can afford it. That rich slow kid who won't learn (for the record, I'm just being extreme for effect) is going to hurt my child's learning progress. It may sound curt, but that kid should not be in the same room as my kid. The poor(er) 4 year old kid who learns just as well as my kid is the kid I want in my son's room.

It will be interesting to see what happens vis-a-vis the questions in my example. Until proven otherwise, in my book, they are more same-same.

Prove me wrong. I hope they can.

[nel123]

Ok I'm digressing now... Can anyone tell me what the schools are like in Udon? Love to hear from the guys that are actually sending their kids to school here.

[pienmash]

Ok, ok, I know everyone is holding their breath just waiting for KD to weigh in on this new development (ha! not!).

KD your postings on education in general are always accurate .. with this particular post you have excelled ...absolutely spot on IMO .... go to the top of the class !!.

During my time in LOS i have worked in various schools including a rural village government (Buriram), Thai government mixed with fee paying programs (BKK/Patts) as well as an International (Ban Chang/Rayong) and will concur both KP and KD make valid points ... for me all were great experiences and i can say the most full filling position was the rural school the salary was the worst no AC but great kids who were all so happy whilst having very little , made the position all the more worthwhile.

Old age and a decrease in my level of patience means i couldnt do it nowadays id kill the little buggars.

Back to the new UIS ,, IMO the word international will mean it will get the students from the wealthier parts of society of course , whether the school can live up to the promotional expectations and build a good name is another thing and only time will tell.

Ok I'm digressing now... Can anyone tell me what the schools are like in Udon? Love to hear from the guys that are actually sending their kids to school here.

My son is 13 and attends Udon Christian school , a mid range Government school . He is by no means an academic more into sports , computer but has and is still doing ok ,,, the thing i like about the set up is that for the last 5 years he has been very settled and happy there and he has developed a confident personality some thing i find missing in many kids out here ... i may be wrong ... ok as in most Thai schools the testing and exam system is a bit of a joke but numbers are not the be all n end all kids go to school for more reasons than just to get A for academics .

The daughter is 17 in Pattanakarn School , again a good set up shes done well , now studying extra as she got a place in college wants to be an air hostess so working towards that .

mash

[KHONDAHM]

Ok I'm digressing now... Can anyone tell me what the schools are like in Udon? Love to hear from the guys that are actually sending their kids to school here.

It's all been asked and/or answered here:
http://www.udonmap.com/udonthaniforum/s ... 15686.html

[grievous]

" Udon Thani International School Home-room foreign teachers are only from the UK, USA, Canada, Australia and New Zealand and must be qualified as a teacher from their home country"

I hope the school is successful and offers a high standard of education, 200,000 baht looks expensive however I just checked the fees of the private school near our home in Melbourne and the fees for pre-primary were 450,000 baht.

[Barney]

The first pile wasn't even driven for the building and the whole post has been negative.


Maybe it's because they will be using the UK standard of education.
Let's hope it is the number one school in UT eventually.
Isn't that what has been wanted by all?

[writemotive]

I hope it's a great school where I can send my 2 daughters. UK standard or American makes no difference to me as long as it is delivered well and brings results! Welcome UTIS !!!!!

[Khun Paul]

Negativity by posters is not what it seems, it is thoughts from people who have seen how the system works here and have in the main either worked inside the Education system or researched the matter thoroughly for their childrens' future.
Many, many schools here spout their credentials but at approx 40to even 50 plus students per class, it is an inescapable fact that the quality of the teaching must therefore deteriorate and with the current situation with the Education system in Thailand all students MUST progress to higher levels despite in some cases being bloody stupid.

Any school wishing to set up must therefore comply with the Ministries objectives and rules of running a school by Thai standards at least, any change could therefore mean no Government assistance and that would then mean the fees would rise exponentially to a new high, which would then make it ridiculous.
So although many of us would welcome a better education for our children we do live in the real world and do not look through rose coloured spectacles. A good dose of cynicism is good , keeps one aware of all the pitfalls and makes you think.

[KHONDAHM]

...the whole post has been negative...

Let's hope it is the number one school in UT eventually.
Isn't that what has been wanted by all?

It's cautious optimism mixed with a healthy dose of skepticism. Just because there is a shiny new "international school" in town, doesn't mean it will live up to the hype. I'll certainly sign my son up if it does; but at those prices, I am pretty much like: "Ok, YOU go first."

[Macca]

...the whole post has been negative...

Let's hope it is the number one school in UT eventually.
Isn't that what has been wanted by all?

It's cautious optimism mixed with a healthy dose of skepticism.

Exactly. Lets face it, just take a look around Udon, it wouldn't be the 1st business to start up then fade away.
About 3 years ago a very modern and eye catching looking school opened on the Kutchap road. I watched with interest and took a look every time I passed by. Not sure what happened but as yet I have not seen a single child there.

Perhaps like everything else they're getting ready for the Asean market, we will see

[marjamlew]

I just had a look at the recruitment link on the website and can't see that they will get the teachers they require, or promise, given what they are proposing to pay, i.e 75,000B a month (negotiable) plus 15,000B living allowance. It is also my experience that the best pre-school and early years teachers are female and I'm not sure what would attract a female teacher to Udon. Another red light for me is that the school principal position advertised only paid 40,000B a month and requires a Thai national. Don't think I'd like to work for a Thai boss getting about 1/2 my pay. Also I would have thought that a true International School, trying to establish itself, would have a strong leadership team with a track record in administration and management in the UK if they are implementing a UK cirriculum.

[Khun Paul]

So as I understand it you as a teacher will be getting approx 75 k plus 15 k living expenses and the boss will get 40 k, yep sounds like a upside down school with little or no admin planning and do you actually think the principal will work when his teachers are getting minimum double his salary. Cloud cuckoo land springs to mind

[grievous]

It's great that people are posting of their experiences with thai schools and education to make people aware of the pitfalls to look out for, however I feel that the new school is being shot down a little before it has a chance to prove itself.
Maybe we should have a wait and see attitude.
There were a lot of really negative posts about where i purchased a house in Udon because of peoples past experiences and I believe they were proven to be incorrect so hopefully the school will do the same and provide a good option for the education of our children.

[KHONDAHM]

Aye, if the admin side ain't solid, it will be a mess with high turnover. I watched that movie before...

However, at those salaries, they would do much better upping the Headmaster's pay and getting a genuine headmaster, and reducing the teacher salary a bit and getting Filipinas/os and Indians. Then assign Thai student assistants to each. Are schools exempted from the x4 Thais requirement? Probably not - because that would make sense...

Alternatively, they could adopt online curricula (I posted details in my document uploaded to the other thread) and reduce overhead and head count significantly while also increasing quality of education significantly. The gist is that the "teachers" would essentially be "facilitators" encouraging the students and assisting those in need. It's all there in that document along with example schools actually doing the same in the Phillipines today (assuming they weren't wiped out by this year's superstorms) and elsewhere.

If the school is able to think outside the box enough to not fall into the same traps as the rest of the "international schools", maybe they really could be different.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Albert Einstein

[Khun Paul]

Agree KH, but in my experience Thais thinking outside the box , is as illogical as thinking they think, OH i am sure ( now pandering to the people who complain about negativity ) that this has been thought out, logically would be the real question.
But as I stated before lets and see, it will never affect me , but it may affect people I know and their children .