Head bashing: potash

Post by **parrot** » April 5, 2011, 9:34 pm

I searched the web high and low for the latest news about head bashing in the local bars.....couldn't find anything. But I came across this piece.......about the local government's meeting with villagers concerning the proposed potash mine in Noon Sung. Apparently more than 500 villagers showed up at today's meeting, including a good number of green-shirt protesters. That apparently didn't go over well with the authorities as some baton-head-bashing took place and some folks had to be transported to the hospital.

There's a lot of money to be made under the ground in that area.....a thick vein of potash.......and I'd bet the Chinese would love to get their hands on a good deal of it.

http://www.manager.co.th/Local/ViewNews ... 0000042858

Post by **bumper** » April 6, 2011, 12:15 pm

Yep and they are really trying hard to get it.

I don't remember which local company is involved. someone posted it some time ago. It's not just the Chinese Aussies want it as well.

Post by **BobHelm** » April 6, 2011, 12:28 pm

Not sure of the 'home' company, but the foreign owner of the deal to extract it is currently Italian.
With the hassle they have endured so far & not a kilo mined I have a feeling that they are probably very much up for a substantial offer to take the problem off their hands.
The China/Laos/Thailand railway project would be an ideal transport route if a business spur could be built.
Direct out of the ground, into railway carriages to China for processing & use takes away many of the issues that partial/full conversion on site & then road transport to a port would cause...
I don't think the current 'owners' have much of a long term extraction strategy in mind....

Post by **stoneman** » April 6, 2011, 2:23 pm

BobHelm wrote:Not sure of the 'home' company, but the foreign owner of the deal to extract it is currently Italian.
With the hassle they have endured so far & not a kilo mined I have a feeling that they are probably very much up for a substantial offer to take the problem off their hands.
The China/Laos/Thailand railway project would be an ideal transport route if a business spur could be built.
Direct out of the ground, into railway carriages to China for processing & use takes away many of the issues that partial/full conversion on site & then road transport to a port would cause...
I don't think the current 'owners' have much of a long term extraction strategy in mind....

I think it would be a great mistake on Thailand's part to allow the potash to be taken out of the country for processing...There is money to be made at the processing level, not to mention jobs and many graft opportunities

Post by **bumper** » April 6, 2011, 3:38 pm

That was it Bob ITD Italian Thai Development and it is the Thai company. Got a lot of other projects going on as well some in Lao and some Burma as well as Thailand. I think what made thing of the Aussies I believe Rio Tinto was trying to buy into pot ash in Canada.

If the pot ash ever goes and will sooner or later ( greed always winds over common sense) ITD stock will go sky high

So far no one has proven it won't ruin the ground water. just what we need some more salty water in the region

Post by **FrazeeDK** » April 6, 2011, 7:17 pm

Yes, it's Italian Thai who have the government concession for the Potash area.. I've posted on this several times in the last few years. The mining interest has been ongoing since 1995 or earlier. With the huge deposits in both the north and south Udon deposits it is indeed a wonder why they've not been exploited..

see about Potash protests

http://aseanyouthmovement.org/2010/02/0 ... tash-mine/

the geological overview:
http://gsa.confex.com/gsa/2005AM/finalp ... _91999.htm

Post by **WhoUrDaddy** » April 6, 2011, 7:34 pm

It is inevitable that the potash will be mined. Two reason, #1 the Thai government has a vested 10 % interest #2 the Thai government has already changed the law, that will allow shallow mining, giving no rights to the land owner at a certain depth, since the potash is close to the surface. They have already started digging some 160 holes in the area, all hitting water, all polluted with salt, all polluted the farm land they were dug on. It will be an environmental nightmare once done. All potash is already contracted to go to China, if I am not mistake and haven't read too much into the research.

As down south and other areas of environmental challenges, they protester, leaders of the protest, will be 'dealt with', as not much stands in the way of profits and corruption here. The farmland left will be dead and useless. Depending on the salt and byproduct level, shrimp farming might not even be possible.

Post by **bumper** » April 7, 2011, 12:30 pm

A question not a statement. Will irrigation water form the Dams allow them to grow crops?

I think that is what they really use for the most part anyway

Post by **lee** » April 7, 2011, 1:14 pm

Does anyone know the actual locations of these proposed mine sites in Udon Thani? If the mining goes ahead there will be two sites (Udon South and Udon North) however I haven't been able to find the exact locations on a map. The Udon South project is apparently 25km's from Udon on the rail track side of the highway but I've no idea where.

Post by **parrot** » April 7, 2011, 8:40 pm

I know one location is in NongTaGai (หนองตะไก้) which is about18km outside of Udon on the KK highway....in the immediate vicinity of the driver's license building. You take a left off the highway, cross the railroad tracks, weave your way around the village a bit (you'll also pass the office trying to obtain the rights to the potash mine) before you arrive at a small park that the office created to pacify the villagers.
All in all, it's only about 2 km from the main highway and a km from the railroad tracks.

Post by **FrazeeDK** » April 8, 2011, 9:55 am

the geological survey map I believe is in the link I posted shows the south Udon deposits on the east side of the railway line from NonTakai as Parrot pointed out north about 6-8 km. The north Udon deposits continue along the railway track and show going as far north as outside the ring road on the east side of Udon. Again, please read the geo survey posting. The potash is NOT shallow mine/open mine process but the deposits are located 300-500 meters down.. That's shaft mining big time and spreading pillar cavern excavations. The problem with mining potash is that to extract the potassium used in fertilizer you have to "wash" it.. This requires massive amounts of water and where to put the polluted water when done??? The NonTakai location is on a watershed ridgeline between water draining north past Udon to the Mekong and water draining south into the Chee river and the Nong Han Khumawapi wetlands/lake area. Done wrong, it will destroy hundreds of square kilometers of farmland/wetlands.. Done right it could mean over 500 jobs in the mine/potash works and making Thailand independent of outside fertilizer needs within a year. Fertilizer is a huge expense for farmer these days since most is imported..

Post by **lee** » April 8, 2011, 10:38 am

Thanks for the information. I've marked the approx location below:

: Udon Thani Potash Map

I found the following diagram which explains the shaft mining process that FrazeeDK pointed out.

: Potash Shaft mining

Post by **Aardvark** » April 8, 2011, 10:46 am

Wow, look at some of those figures, 20.000 tons a day for 6.000 tons of Potash and 14000 tons of Tailings. I can see how the Tailings can be stored on site for a time before they find some where to bury them, but what will they do with all of that contaminated Water ??

Post by **parrot** » April 8, 2011, 7:44 pm

"what will they do with all of that contaminated Water ??"

Or....where will they get all that water to contaminate?

Post by **FrazeeDK** » April 9, 2011, 3:21 pm

note the following which raises questions as to why the Udon Potash deposits is not being exploited..

from the BKK Post today:

The government's latest move to cap the price of fertiliser could lead to a domestic supply shortage, economists warned yesterday.

The country could see a repeat of the problems experienced with palm oil, when price caps deterred companies from producing cooking oil because their raw material costs were soaring, said Praipol Khumsap, an economics lecturer at Thammasat University. "We would prefer to see fertiliser be available, although the price may be higher," he said.
Commerce Minister Porntiva Nakasai overturned her staff at the Internal Trade Department, vetoing price increases of 10-35%, which would have taken effect on Thursday. Oil is a key component in fertiliser and its price has been climbing.
Patamawadee Suzuki, an economics professor at Thammasat University, attributed the domestic shortage of palm oil in mid-March to the government's mishandling of stocks.
She said that continuing price controls on fertiliser could also lead producers to reduce its quality. A better solution would be for the government to communicate with farmers directly to explain why it needs to raise the price and the consequences if it caps prices. "It's time that society accepts the cost of living is more expensive," she said.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/eco ... -next-blow

Post by **parrot** » April 9, 2011, 8:21 pm

"note the following which raises questions as to why the Udon Potash deposits is not being exploited."

I was half expecting the article to mention the yet-untapped potash mine in Udon.
It's probably just a matter of time before the company/government gets its way........but no matter the promises, I'd not want to be living in the immediate area of where the mining/trucking will take place.

Post by **bumper** » April 25, 2014, 2:50 pm

Scheduled to go into production in 2016

http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/new ... t-for-2016

Post by **FrazeeDK** » April 25, 2014, 7:28 pm

an old web page but it outlines in detail the APPC plans for two mines in Udon and where they are. http://www.scottmurray.com/asia_pacific ... ration.htm

planned production is 2 million tonnes per year.. From Googled data the current prices of Potash (14 April) is about $309 USD per tonne = $618 million per year... Note the Potash market dropped significantly from 2009 when it was abtou $850 per tonne.

and who owns APPC?? Italian-Thai Development which is hugely into infrastructure projects in Thailand and around the world. http://www.itd.co.th/index.php/en/news-and-activity

Post by **FrazeeDK** » April 25, 2014, 7:42 pm

a 2011 Udon Map news article on the mine...http://www.udonmap.com/udonthaninews/ud ... h-project/

Post by **bumper** » April 26, 2014, 9:33 am

ITD good question, they have pulled out of several projects, they are not a well managed company, They had big piece of the Dam project in Lao. But, pulled out. I guess the biggy here in the ground is already salty in a lot of places. Truck traffic, road destruction . No idea about dust in the air.