American Politics - Single thread

Post by **arjay** » August 3, 2008, 11:15 pm

Please post all material relating to American politics or Obama what's his name on this thread.

As an alternative you may wish to post and debate them here:-

http://www.americanpoliticsforum.com/

Thanks.

Post by **rickfarang** » August 3, 2008, 11:23 pm

Thank you, Arjay.

Post by **Buffalo Soldier** » August 4, 2008, 12:33 am

ricohoc wrote:You are mistaken, Buffalo Soldier.

I challenge you to show racial prejudice or racism in any of my posts. If the mere criticism of a man's policies who happens to be black is racism to you, then you have no idea what racism really is, and that explains your first post in this thread very well.

The truth is that the US has MANY African Americans who have distinguished themselves in medicine, law, corporate ownership, politics and many other areas. Some are even representing predominantly white regions of the country in their social and political positions. THAT is the truth, my friend.

I am eagerly awaiting your list of my racial statements. And don't disappear. To accuse someont of racism merely because they disagree with a black man is a serious charge. Put up or lock down your keyboard, my friend.
Very Happy

I can assure you I am well aware of what racism is having lived it for long enough.

One thing that jumped out at me recently (correct me if I'm wrong) was you don't even call the man by his name. you make post after post referring to him as BHO... A subtle way to use his middle name as did McCain when he repeatedly at a rally used Obama's middle name for political purchase. Denigrating his name is akin to denigrating the name of Benjamin Franklin.

Sir, I accept you are not racist and I accept you just do not believe in the man because of his policies. I unreservedly apologise for any offence caused.

As a European I will now bow out of this discussion and best of luck to whoever becomes the next president of the USA.

Dankjewel.

Post by **UdonExpat** » August 4, 2008, 9:39 am

Great move. US politics has been nearly beat to death on this forum. It'll be good to have it all in one thread rather than multiple threads. After all, there is no shortage of political threads on the hundreds of other forums dedicated to various political beliefs.

Post by **Bandung_Dero** » August 4, 2008, 10:51 am

Arjay, while I agree with your motives I think combining all facets of USA politics into one and only thread is a bit overboard. It could prejudice other sub forums eg sport, football in one thread etc. If guys like Ricohoc were a bit more responsible in not trying to hijack the whole site we could proceed as normal.

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 4, 2008, 1:46 pm

edit,bkkstan

Post by **arjay** » August 5, 2008, 11:58 am

Bandung, I believe Lee is working on a way to accommodate your point and achieve a more balanced situation.

Watch the Forum titles for developments!

Post by **UdonExpat** » August 5, 2008, 1:40 pm

Whatever happens with this forum don't forget to vote. Need some motivation?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amukRM9SSoo

Register to vote and request your absentee ballet NOW!!!

http://www.votefromabroad.org/

This site is run by Democrats but it will work regardless of your political affiliations.

Post by **JimboPSM** » August 7, 2008, 5:52 am

........ and there could be another candidate =D> or should that be

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 7, 2008, 5:59 am

Here is a platform for you

FRom an email received:

I HAVE DECIDED TO BECOME A WRITE-IN CANDIDATE.
HERE IS MY PLATFORM:

(1) Press 1 for English is immediately banned. English is the official language; speak it or wait at the border until you can.

(2) We will immediately go into a two year isolationist posture to straighten out the country's attitude. NO imports, no exports. We will use the 'Walmart' policy, 'If we ain't got it, you don't need it.'

(3) When imports are allowed, there will be a 100% import tax on it.

(4) All retired military personnel will be required to man one of our many observation towers on the southern border. (six month tour) They will be under strict orders not to fire on SOUTHBOUND aliens.

(5) Social security will immediately return to its original state. If you didn't put nuttin in, you ain't gettin nuttin out. The president nor any other politician will not be abl e to touch it.

(6) Welfare - Checks will be handed out on Fridays at the end of the 40 hour school week and the successful completion of urinalysis and a passing grade.

(7) Professional Athletes --Steroids - The FIRST time you check positive you're banned for life.

(8) Crime - We will adopt the Turkish method, the first time you steal, you lose your right hand. There is no more life sentences. If convicted, you will be put to death by the same method you chose for your victim; gun, knife, strangulation, etc.

(9) One export will be allowed; Wheat, The world needs to eat. A bushel of wheat will be the exact price of a barrel of oil.

(10) All foreign aid using American taxpayer money will
immediately cease, and the saved money will pay off the
national debt and ultimately lower taxes. When disasters
occur around the world, we'll ask the American people if they want to donate to a disaster fund, and each citizen
can make the decision whether it's a worthy cause.

(11) The Pledge of Allegiance will be said every day at school and every day in Congress.

(12) The National Anthem will be played at all appropriate
ceremonies, sporting events, outings, etc.

Sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes but a vote for me will get you better than what you have, and better than what you're gonna get.
Thanks for listening, and remember to write in my name on the ballot in November. God Bless America!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by **banpaeng** » August 8, 2008, 5:24 am

I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 8, 2008, 6:06 am

Barack's Cabinet

Confident of a victory in November, Obama has announced his cabinet selections. Thought you might like to see who some of them are.

Barack's Cabinet

Confident of a victory in November, Obama has announced his cabinet selections. Thought you might like to see who some of them are.

Yes,it was an email sent to me!It could have gone in the joke thread,but I didn't want to alter the new political setup

Had another this morning for the Obama cabinet selections:Bin strokn'(Clinton Bill),Bin Bitn'(Mike Tyson),Bin Lyin'(O J Simpson) and Bin Cheatn'(Jesse Jackson) from an Obama supporter friend

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 8, 2008, 7:50 am

banpaeng wrote:I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.

It is a joke,but I would disagree about it all being wrong!

Ulta Nationalistic and Isolationist in total,but not all wrong!

I believe the writer said ''Walmart policy'' statement,not products sold only at Walmart!

Here is my reply to the email,which states many of my political views at present:
Here is one for you!My political views are mixed,conservative in some areas and liberal in others!I like to think that I am realistic,but doesn't everybody!

I prefer McCain to Obama in most areas.But I like Obamas charisma,but fear his naivity and inexperience!I believe in change,but not abrupt change that risks the security of America!I believe abrupt change creates as many problems,if not more,than the problems it addresses!Although,in my heart ,I believe ''change''is just a political platitude to rally anti-Bush supporters and that Obama is just another politician trying to claim his spot in the sun!I just do not know what he relly is about with the exception that he is the most extreme liberal in our legislature portion of gov't.To extreme,inexperienced to trust at the helm!

I believe we are at war with Islamic extremism and I support a type of ''martial law''that temporarily suspends many of our ''rights''in order to protect those rights and our Nation!I have more fear of The present danger from outside than I do of one from ''inside'' our gov't!

I support doing whatever is necessary to free ourselves from foreign energy sources,especially drilling,building refineries and Nuclear.I support using food source fuel alternatives only if they are extra and above normal crop production for food,maybe Genetically enhanced products only(I have not thought this one through).

I don't believe in abortion,as I see it as killing a ''breathing human life'',but I do believe in birth control with a ''day after sex pill''with some embarassing restrictions for the individual that applies as a possible deterent to unprotected sex!

I believe in parental control and teaching to prevent abuse!I believe in a penalty system that favors victims rights in sentencing,including restitution by 200% for material losses and full payment for counseling needed from offenders earnings while incarcerated with a no work-no eat policy that lets them die if they choose!

I believe that amnesty is the only solution to the present immigration policy and the borders must be secured at all costs!Mandatory imprisonment for employers knowly hiring illegals!Guest workers programs as passed by individual states as needed only!

I don't believe we made the right decision about Iraq(after the fact,I support it ,but not Rumsfields low manpower plan).We should have used enough manpower to topple Saddam and secure the borders and maintain the infrastructure as possible or secretly removed Saddam and his family from power if possible!

I believe our policies of trying to democratize the World is flawed ,if done by force because it is arrogant and shows a lack of understanding of other peoples cultures and involvement in their religions(thousands of years developing their cultural life ,while we have been in existance for 200+ years!

I would like to see the USA not overfund forums that oppose us in principle,such as the UN as a whole entity,which in my opinion has no teeth and a waste of time and money!

I oppose all attempts at World gov't as I see it as a waste of resources and a way to be manipulated by those of a more socialistic gov't bent!I don't believe it is realistic as Nationalism and selfishness will always play the big part.

The EU is a minature example and the problems just get larger with the increase in size.There will never be a cultural coming together and people just don't respect or understand the different cultures enough to form and maintain a United World!

It would take a threat to the World as a whole from another planet to even get a consensus amongst the people,even then we would probably not find unity!

I have many views ,but these is some!

Wishing you all the very best,Love Stan

Post by **jackspratt** » August 8, 2008, 7:52 am

banpaeng wrote:I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.

For some reason I don't think Stan is kidding

Post by **Guns482** » August 8, 2008, 8:21 am

Thankyou for putting all the posts on US politics on one site, there have been often other posts hijacked by political comments especially relating to the US presidential cat fight.
So now having loooked at this, I can assume no hijacking will occur and other posts can be read without some mundane useless comment about US politics infringing.#Thank-you and success to the winner and commiserations to the loser in the US race.
Fopr me thats all bye bye.

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 8, 2008, 8:33 am

jackspratt wrote:
banpaeng wrote:I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.
For some reason I don't think Stan is kidding

I really don't mind opposing views to mine,but in this case,I believe I stated that this was from an email received with a

,and I further stated in a reply that I didn't believe that it was all wrong!

It might be helpful if you read what I say or post,if you want to criticize or comment on it!!Then it would be understood that you were commenting on it rather than what you read into it!

I have also posted some of my present views,with some of my reasoning!

It might help if others that agree or oppose some of these views,while criticizing or not,post their views and reasoning!

I am open to questioning of my views by others as I question myself!

Post by **banpaeng** » August 8, 2008, 8:48 am

BKKSTAN wrote:
banpaeng wrote:I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.
It is a joke,but I would disagree about it all being wrong!

Ulta Nationalistic and Isolationist in total,but not all wrong!

It is not even right. There is a legal immigration policy and to close that off is wrong. Illegal immigration should be stopped. Will it? Only in a dream and neither candidate has a clue or answer

I believe the writer said ''Walmart policy'' statement,not products sold only at Walmart!

Do you really think this guy does not know who butters his bread. Neither canditate has a clue either.

Here is my reply to the email,which states many of my political views at present:
Here is one for you!My political views are mixed,conservative in some areas and liberal in others!I like to think that I am realistic,but doesn't everybody!
I prefer McCain to Obama in most areas.But I like Obamas charisma,but fear his naivity and inexperience!I believe in change,but not abrupt change that risks the security of America!I believe abrupt change creates as many problems,if not more,than the problems it addresses!Although,in my heart ,I believe ''change''is just a political platitude to rally anti-Bush supporters and that Obama is just another politician trying to claim his spot in the sun!I just do not know what he relly is about with the exception that he is the most extreme liberal in our legislature portion of gov't.To extreme,inexperienced to trust at the helm!

Obama and change. You have got to be joking. No policy he has said is nothing more than give and spend. McCain is nothing more than Bush except bush holds to his plan working or not and Mc Cain will pander for a vote like a cheap *****. Neither candidate deserves any votes.

I believe we are at war with Islamic extremism and I support a type of ''martial law''that temporarily suspends many of our ''rights''in order to protect those rights and our Nation!I have more fear of The present danger from outside than I do of one from ''inside'' our gov't!

Get out of town!! I've seen to much of this. As long as it does not bother me then it is ok, however as soon as it is in my back yard, hell no.

If either candidate supports this he needs to be run out of the country!!!!

I support doing whatever is necessary to free ourselves from foreign energy sources,especially drilling,building refineries and Nuclear.I support using food source fuel alternatives only if they are extra and above normal crop production for food,maybe Genetically enhanced products only(I have not thought this one through).

The only way to become independent of foreign oil is for Americans to understand what has to be done. Again not in my backyard. Does either candidate have a clue? Hell no!!!!

I don't believe in abortion,as I see it as killing a ''breathing human life'',but I do believe in birth control with a ''day after sex pill''with some embarassing restrictions for the individual that applies as a possible deterent to unprotected sex!

I will not argue this with you only give my view point. It is a womans body and should be a choice between herself and whatever spiritual counsel she would like to accept. Why is it always (and it usually is) that try to legislate morals and what a woman can do or not do. Why the embarrassing restrictions? Are we trying to institute some psedo Christian morals on someone who might not give a darn.

I am sure I missed something but have not really seen either candidate position.

I believe in parental control and teaching to prevent abuse!I believe in a penalty system that favors victims rights in sentencing,including restitution by 200% for material losses and full payment for counseling needed from offenders earnings while incarcerated with a no work-no eat policy that lets them die if they choose!

Not even sure what the first sentence means. AS for the second part, what a bunch of hooey. First they can not feed them. Lets see pig swill comes to mind. As for restitution, how are losers going to make restitution. Sure a few get out of prison and actually make money and a good living. As for the rest of these offenders, most are just worthless.

Law and order is not getting much platform this season.

I believe that amnesty is the only solution to the present immigration policy and the borders must be secured at all costs!Mandatory imprisonment for employers knowly hiring illegals!Guest workers programs as passed by individual states as needed only!

I do not have an answer to this except to say that due to the current illegal labor shortage, food prices are rising. Sure Oil caused a bit of it but not able to find workers to do the work is about to shut down Hatch Arizona. Hatch Arizona is pepper capital of the US.

As stated I don't have a clue on this one but neither candidate does for sure has no clue.

I don't believe we made the right decision about Iraq(after the fact,I support it ,but not Rumsfields low manpower plan).We should have used enough manpower to topple Saddam and secure the borders and maintain the infrastructure as possible or secretly removed Saddam and his family from power if possible!

Back seat driving is a good post. IMHO this will never be finished. It is a culture of he who has the big gun will lead. When the US leaves it will get settled. Like I said who ever has the big gun.

Again neither candidate has any thing but BS to spread.

I believe our policies of trying to democratize the World is flawed ,if done by force because it is arrogant and shows a lack of understanding of other peoples cultures and involvement in their religions(thousands of years developing their cultural life ,while we have been in existance for 200+ years!

Hooray we agree 100%.Democracy never flies unless the people support it. However our gov't gets sucked in time and time again with the new guy on the block that says he wants democracy and all he want is to get that big gun so he can be in charge.

Will this change with either candidate. No way!!!

I would like to see the USA not overfund forums that oppose us in principle,such as the UN as a whole entity,which in my opinion has no teeth and a waste of time and money!

Agreed again but neither candidate will change a thing.

I oppose all attempts at World gov't as I see it as a waste of resources and a way to be manipulated by those of a more socialistic gov't bent!I don't believe it is realistic as Nationalism and selfishness will always play the big part.

I'll leave you alone on this one as I agree.

The EU is a minature example and the problems just get larger with the increase in size.There will never be a cultural coming together and people just don't respect or understand the different cultures enough to form and maintain a United World!

Go EU. Only makes a few of our errors look better. However beings I have even gone on thr forum live with why do others meddle in the US business, I will not meddle in theres. Wish someone would tell our two candidates to leave others alone.

It would take a threat to the World as a whole from another planet to even get a consensus amongst the people,even then we would probably not find unity!

Aliens!!!!!!!!

I have many views ,but these is some!

Wish someone would come out of the woodwork to run for president as neither will get a vote from me as neither deserves it.

Wishing you all the very best,Love Stan

Post by **jackspratt** » August 8, 2008, 9:03 am

BKKSTAN wrote:
jackspratt wrote:
banpaeng wrote:I only hope you are kidding Stan. Don't have to go far to see this is wrong. If we do like walmart, 90% of the stuff sold is imported from China.
For some reason I don't think Stan is kidding
I really don't mind opposing views to mine,but in this case,I believe I stated that this was from an email received with a ,and I further stated in a reply that I didn't believe that it was all wrong!

It might be helpful if you read what I say or post,if you want to criticize or comment on it!!Then it would be understood that you were commenting on it rather than what you read into it!

I have also posted some of my present views,with some of my reasoning!

It might help if others that agree or oppose some of these views,while criticizing or not,post their views and reasoning!

I am open to questioning of my views by others as I question myself!

Apologies Stan. I was writing my response as you were about to post your lengthy personal views. So we overlapped - the vagaries of cyberspace.

Post by **BKKSTAN** » August 8, 2008, 9:52 am

Thanks for your opinions and some views banpaeng!

I agree that neither are inspiring and I don't see McCain as an extension of Bush,but more similar to Bush than Obama in some areas.Possibly because I don't feel Bush is as bad as some people have painted him!

My point is Mc Cain has the experience to go the patient route with change,while Obama is untested and unknown except for radicl liberalism!So a vote for McCain ,IMO,is worthy just as a safeguard aginst radical change!

I believe ''guest worker'' programs would solve the ''pepper capital'' problem!

My comments regarding victims restitution was directed to the type of punishment and incarceration of the perps.Make them work,pay for their own keep and restitution from their pay.Example:put them in chain gangs in ''Pepper capital''labor situations with''guest worker pay'' less expenses and restitution!Just letting them lay around in prison only increases crime and costs,IMO!

''Get out of town'' comment confuses me,unless you believe their is more danger from within than from the foreign enemies!I believe that in the age of WMDs,we must take more extreme measures to insure our security from outside terrorist attacks!

I see amnesty with closing the border as the only solution to begin to solve the problem.I believe it is unrealistic to attempt to arrest and incarcerate all illegals.Pardoning the past is part of healing the future,but the border needs to be secured at all costs!Some effective action has to be taken,IMO!

I can not agree with abandoning Iraq until the stabilization is in effect.Both the stabilization that the Iraq gov't needs and the prevention of the expansion of Iran in the Region!But I believe we should leave as soon as the Iraqi gov't wants us to leave or refuses our needs to protect our forces!Once they have sided with Iran,they should be left on their own!In the mean time ,we have the responsibilty to clean up our mess made by the poor military decisions of Rumsfield and allowed by Bush!

My reference to parental control had to do with my opposition to ''big gov't'' and ''nanny state''thinking.That many of our problems in society have to do with children that grow up without parents control and responsibility being exercised with proper discipline because of gov't rules!

I am hopeful that the mistakes made in the past relating to cultural differences ,will in fact be lessons heeded in the future!Whether or not either of these candidates will understand that or not,we don't know!

The EU example was used by me to show the difficulty involved in World gov't amongst differing National and cultural interests,not an attempt to meddle in European politics!

And I don't believe in Aliens

but I am open to the possibilty

That was used as an example of the perceived extreme danger to the whole World in order to unite the World!This again would be temporary at best because IMO,selfishness is the basic human flaw!

Post by **banpaeng** » August 8, 2008, 10:13 am

BKKSTAN wrote:
I believe ''guest worker'' programs would solve the ''pepper capital'' problem!

I want to answer the rest of your post but it is late and I need at least a year of beauty sleep and even then it most likely won't help.

The guest worker program won't help in this case. The new minimum wage is $7 plus (to lazy to look it up). However that is not what the farmer will have to pay the people as then you add in the part of SS he has to make up, and unemployment tax, plus liability insurance make the farmer paying about $12. Can't sell the peppers as too high.

So I am saying I am for illegal aliens. No I am against illegal immigration. Can you make the folks here work doing that. No way as that is beneath them.

To me this is like saying I am for the illegals but against the legals. There is no real answer. I would like it to be that the welfare able bodied were told to go do this for minimum wage. There is no politicians that would vote for this. You can not make the prisoners work for private enterprise as that creates unfair advantage.

Sounds like I am being negative and if I want to gripe I should present an idea. Sorry don't have one except hang all the politicians, and yes I do have the rope.