Deaths in Bangkok

[santa]

Parrot can you give me any info on Elmer Lynch, he is my wife's father from his first wife?

[parrot]

Santa,
I sent you a pm. Look at the top of this page.......it should say:
"User Control Panel (1 new messages) "

Click on that line and you'll get to your inbox.

[bumper]

Ring Road lot more check points this morning but all they seemed to be doing is writing tickets. From the airport to Global.

[jackspratt]

I have driven from Ban Dung to Cha Am today, via Highway 2.

If a few buses were held up in Udon, it is not going to make much difference. We passed probably 50-70 full mini-buses, together with about 6 large black police trucks in a several different convoys between Korat and Saraburi.

In addition, we went through probably 4 large police road blocks where all pickups with more than a couple of adults in the back (red shirts or not) were being searched, plus vehicle and drivers licence details being taken, and being input to some form of electronic device about the size of 2 iPhones. The road blocks were a mixture of police and army. In addition to the road blocks, in 3 or 4 places between Udon and Korat the road had been narrowed to a single lane, and army guys were noting and taking details of all "likely" vehicles which went past (without any search).

There was also a large red shirt road block just south of where the Kumpuwapi road comes out on Highway 2, but nothing after that.

Did not see any easily identifiable red shirts in vehicles heading south, but did pass two vehicles with red shirts between Kumpuwapi and Nong Han.

With a farang driving the car, we were waved through on each occasion - easily the most hassle free drive south I have had in 3 years.

An update.

This morning I drove from Cha Am back to Bangkok, to get a visa (for a 3rd country).

Along the way we passed a convoy of 50+ white Toyota mini buses, all full of (I assume) police. Also in the convoy were about 6 large black police trucks, and a few of the normal brown and white pickups.

After enduring the horrors of Bangkok traffic (thank god for GPS), we drove south again to Cha Am. At about 1pm, 20 - 30km out of Bangkok there was a red shirt road block - set up, at all places, alongside one of those Highway Police offices built in the middle of the highway.

Unfortunately (for the red shirts) the stable door was left open in the morning, and the brown horse had well and truly bolted.

[trubrit]

Just getting news of massive army equipment movements by train from Udon. Also all local governors have been ordered by Bangkok to provide armed escort for future police re deployments. As a consequence more volunteers are being asked to man the existing road blocks . Don't know if this will bring the sound of gunfire nearer home , but just going out to observe . Will report any further developments .

[trubrit]

Further to the above . Sorry I couldn't give details earlier but there was a massive power failure in the area immediately after I wrote the above and it didn't come back on till 2am this morning .
Yes there was large amounts of armoured vehicles in Udon but it turns out they were the weaponry that had been stopped in Khon Khaen by the red shirts last week, being returned to barracks up here .so the demonstrators quickly dispersed .
However one more item of concern . The Governor of Udon Thani has used his powers to declare a state of emergency exists here, so therefore groups of more than 5 are illegal and liable to arrest .I can't find out how far the area covered extends.

[Khun Paul]

While I find it midly interesting the original post was about deaths in bangkok and related subjects. Publicised vehicle and tropp/police movements really have nothing to do with the original post and most of us are quite able to access this news from other sources.
S stste of emergency in udon Thani province that is interesting and would give rise to concernsif it was properly enacted but judging by the current police attitude, I have no fear of that ever happening.

[trubrit]

While I find it midly interesting the original post was about deaths in bangkok and related subjects. Publicised vehicle and tropp/police movements really have nothing to do with the original post and most of us are quite able to access this news from other sources.
S stste of emergency in udon Thani province that is interesting and would give rise to concernsif it was properly enacted but judging by the current police attitude, I have no fear of that ever happening.

KP. Can't you see if the army or police reinforcements were to arrive in Bangkok it would possibly lead to more"Deaths in Bangkok" So the stopping of their movement is very relevant to the topic.

[bumper]

Good Point

[FrazeeDK]

well, the "deaths in Bangkok" start of the thread lead naturally to a following of the Red Shirt actions since the 10th of April.

Things have evolved.. Today the Reds as you saw in the news caused a shutdown of the BTS Sukhumvit line after stacking tires in the Chidlom station around 5 AM.. Seems they heard that troops would come in via BTS to retake Rajaprasong. No, contrary to early reports they didn't block the tracks with the tires. The Police and Military officers "negotiated" with the Red Shirts at Chidlom getting agreement to remove the tires and allowing the BTS to reopen around 10AM today.

Red Shirt road blocks at Wittayu/Ploenchit, LangSuan/Sarasin, Chidlom/Petchburi are beefed up with more bamboo abatis, more tires, and strips of cloth attached to the whole mess. Rumor was that the cloth was soaked in gasoline to allow the Reds to start a burning tire conflagration, but having walked by a number of these roadblocks I can attest there's no smell of petroleum products.

This morning walked around Lumpini at 6AM.. Police vehicles (some with outside of BKK license plates) are parked at various buildings. Numerous police are billeted at those buildings (perhaps 300-500 total). What's strange about this is that I only saw a few police there Saturday evening at 1800.. It appears that the police and Red leaders must have agreed to each of their "allowed" areas...

Tension appears to be rising overall.. I don't think anyone but the leaders and power players of the many factions involved (Reds/Gov't/police/military/Yellows) might know where this is all going... Wheels within wheels within wheels.. TIT

[trubrit]

There are so many equations in this plot that it is difficult to say where it is going to end . Today Abhisit was reported to be seeking the advise of the entire cabinet as to his next move , so apparently he hasn't got a clue .Well if he hasn't who has .? His deputy was blustering on about if the army and the police don't obey his orders , they are out . Pretty decisive politics that . A government without an army and no police . Also today I was shown a video, admittedly by the reds, showing 300police who had been billeted in the National stadium since this all started, staging a sit down strike and refusing to go out there again. They just want to go home .It would seem everybody just wants to go home except Abhisit. :-"

[bumper]

Maybe that is why they are not doing anything, can't say I blame them for wanting go home. Stuck in the heat and sun all day with that equipment on. For what just to do it again the next day. If the guy calling the shots got out his Aircon and stood with them this would have been over long ago. The not acting on the problem is wearing them down, would me to.

As worn out as they have to be I could beat three of them myself. What a waist of manpower.

One thing was pointed out to me by another poster, what will the long term effects of this be they have now went this far, they going to listen to the village Pu Yai?

One way or another I think we are seeing the beginning of a new Thailand. What that matures to be we just have to wait and see.

The P.M. as one man I believe would have dropped out long ago. This is very complicated behind the scenes. They will move at some point to much pressure not to, When the army shows up I'm hoping the protesters fold and blend in with crowds, It would be insane to do anything else.

But I don't call the shots on either side. In heart I believe people will be hurt at that site question is how many and more then likely it's going to be on both sides. I hope I'm wrong

[jackspratt]

FDK yours is the only report I have read that the tyres were not placed on the BTS tracks at Chidlom.

Is yours a first hand report, and if so, can you give more details?

[jackspratt]

There are so many equations in this plot that it is difficult to say where it is going to end . Today Abhisit was reported to be seeking the advise of the entire cabinet as to his next move , so apparently he hasn't got a clue .Well if he hasn't who has .? His deputy was blustering on about if the army and the police don't obey his orders , they are out . Pretty decisive politics that . A government without an army and no police . Also today I was shown a video, admittedly by the reds, showing 300police who had been billeted in the National stadium since this all started, staging a sit down strike and refusing to go out there again. They just want to go home .It would seem everybody just wants to go home except Abhisit. :-"

I wasn't aware that anyone was stopping the red shirts from going home. After that, it there appears no reason for the police and army not to follow in short order.

Then hopefully, once a semblance of civil order has been restored, a free and fair election will follow.

Val, what is your level of confidence that the Dems, or the Yellow Shirts for that matter, could freely campaign in your Mu Baan in the upcoming election (putting aside the question of vote buying which will occur from all sides as a matter of course)?

[old-timer]

OT went to the red shirts HQ udon, in view of starting a falang radio show, just a couple of hours on a saturday or sunday, anyway, they were well up for it but OT bottled out.
Am I on subject ?

OT.....

[trubrit]

[

Val, what is your level of confidence that the Dems, or the Yellow Shirts for that matter, could freely campaign in your Mu Baan in the upcoming election (putting aside the question of vote buying which will occur from all sides as a matter of course)?

Possibly you don't know that the three leading members of the Udon community are all of PAD persuasion. The governor, mayor and ex mayor , now senator .So I don't see any problem

[Khun Paul]

I am too familiar with troop and police movements NOT to understand that any increase will possible bring more deaths.
However I must point out that for the ( possible up to ) 10000 Red shirts it would be unwelcome but for the other 12-15 million people living in Bangkok attempting in some cases to make a living it would be mild response to what is seemingly becoming a Public and Political farce of immense proportions.

Although we tend to put a Western slant on an Asian problem,( we often see severe crackdowns and the like emanating in Asian Countries ) personally for me , I am interested in the reaction of the Government to this problem and sincerly hope that it will not impact on my tenure here.

It is no doubt a truly Thai problem being dealt with a such an haphazard way that any infomation about movement of security forces , I personally take with a very large pinch of salt. It would seem that from my information this will be a protracted problem untill as such time the Reds get fed up or the general public are completely fed up with the ongoing situation. The current attitude of the reds is democracy on their terms and it seems that theirrecent actions are highlighting that fact with their apparant ease of disrupting normal life , costing ordinary people in some cases their whole way of life. What is more disconcerting it it clear that the Reds do not care for the ordinary citizen more themselves.
I agree that a properly run rally which respects the normal parameters of rallys and ensures that for the ordinary Joe Public life can continue is Ok, but where the rally destroys/damages property. destrys ordinary people ability to work or to survive, then the rally has degenerated into a personal fight against us ALL.

And ANY measures to secure the normal resumption of daily life should be undertaken probably at a cost but then that is the crux of the matter isn't it really...COST, lives will be lost, people will be injured, but then think WHY. If every person who has been affected by this red Shirt Rally objected , the reds would come face to face with tens of thousands of people ( their countrymen) who just want to live a peaceful live.
In this case Justice must not only be done but must be seen to be done, for all Thais NOT just for the Reds shirts or even the Yellow shirts. But for my neighbour who is having a tough time because the money her son makes in bangkok has stopped because he cannot work ...Why because he works in the large malls which have been closed Why because of the red shirts...My neighbour only 67 years old asks Why.......I just want to live peacefully.
That is why I understand but in reality I do not care I just want to live and if someone loses their life....so be it.
The main argument is flawed, the actions flawed and the result will be FLAWED....!!

[nkstan]

I agree with KP!A Gov't has to make sure that the rule of law,at the time is enFORCED!I abhore the loss of life,but that responsibility belongs to the lawbreakers,no matter the cause being noble or not!Anarchy can not prevail,for the price in lives and a wrecked economy will be far greater over time as a precedent is put in place for for the disgruntled of the future.

What is happening is not a civil protest,it is a classic power struggle that always ends with the most powerful in power.

The gov'ts ''patience'' or ''hopefullness'' has been read as a sign of weakness,escalating the aggressive actions of the protesters!

The mixed loyalties inside the police and army has to be sorted out,As the stymied economy begins to painfully hurt the majority of the population,the playful attitudes at roadblocks and sites of confrontation will turn to desperate angry acts,setting off civil warring conflicts that will cause more devisiveness and loss of life than a crackdown,although the gov'tight have already waited to long to properly organize themselves for a crackdown,initiating non-color guerrilla actions by the extremists amongst the various sides!

Although an individual is not mandated to be political,it might take a personal appeal by Him for those who claim their loyalty to the Monarchy,to peacefully ,go home,to end the fighting and destruction!

My thinking is first of all selfish,I admit,as I too am concerned about my tenure here,but I also would like to see and end to the conflict without more bloodshed and loss of economic livlihood amongst the Thai people!

[nkstan]

OT went to the red shirts HQ udon, in view of starting a falang radio show

To what end?????

[trubrit]

OT went to the red shirts HQ udon, in view of starting a falang radio show

To what end?????

Actually here in Udon they do have an Australian guy broadcasting every afternoon .Doesn't pull his punches either .Some of you may possibly know him