Does anyone else feel ashamed about what we did in Iraq?

[DesertStorm]

I was a US combat soldier during Desert Storm and always felt like we were there for the right reasons. I didn't particularly care for the 'road to Basra' attack but, hey, they WERE the enemy.

When no weapons of mass destruction were found after the Iraw invasion, I started to feel very unhappy.

I was even unhappier when I found out that we'd killed over 1,000,000 Iraqis and that more than 80% of all of Iraqi industries are now 'foreign owned'. I'm being polite here by not pointing a finger at our rotten multinational corporations. Oops. I've gone and done it!

I'm really happy that our relations with Israel have soured though because it means that we won't be invading Iran anytime soon.

Yes, this is is my first post and I'm new to town!

[jackspratt]

As Australia was party to the deception, and the invasion, my answer is YES.

[Texpat]

No. Not in the least.

[ronan01]

more sad than ashamed - i think too many iraqis (civilians) died for no real "gain".

[Texpat]

Yes, this is is my first post and I'm new to town!

Odd that someone who feels ashamed about liberating Iraq would chose DesertStorm as his username.

I smell a fish.

[trubrit]

What has this got to do with" General Udon Thani "?

[lepidoptra]

What has this got to do with" General Udon Thani "?

Nothing really but give the guy a chance he is new to the site and there are many other posts that have nothing whatsoever to do with Udon Thani.
If he felt that the troops believed what they were doing was true and right then nobody should feel ashamed. I do feel however that 1,000,000 people killed by allied troops is not necessarily accurate.
Welcome to UM

[Texpat]

I do feel however that 1,000,000 people killed by allied troops is not necessarily accurate.

Facts are always trumped by emotional hyperbole.

[jackspratt]

Facts are always trumped by emotional hyperbole.

You have made us all too aware of that through a multitude of your posts.

[RLTrader]

Yes, this is is my first post and I'm new to town!

Wrong topic for this site, they will be out with a vengeance, and only your first post.

[arjay]

What has this got to do with" General Udon Thani "?

I tend to think along the lines of Trubrit here, so it's been moved to the General Debates Forum.

This is rather an emotive and unusual topic for a new member to be posting about on a Udon Thani Forum. Such things usually make me think of rickety bridges. (Time will tell I guess).

I tend to feel there is a difference between a long standing member wanting to air a frustration, or initiate or broaden a discussion about some wider issue, as opposed to a brand new member starting an emotive debate, particularly if the topic is about something which has little or nothing to do with Udon Thani, and is likely to fuel a heated debate.

Anyway, if "Desert Storm" is genuinely seeking members views, IMHO I think that overall the right objective was achieved in terms of deposing Saddam, even if the original justification/reasoning was flawed and perhaps thus "illegitimate". :-" There were also other issues involved besides WMD.

[Aardvark]

So, what is the solution ? Go for it or Ignore ? Who wants a Debate ? Up to you !

[DesertStorm]

Gentlemen, I understand that it's common practice to bash new users on Internet forums, but I can assure you I'm the genuine article!

It was the 1991 campaign that I was directly involved in and not the invasion. Hence my username and not my shame!

And sorry, but I didn't know where else to put this thread. I am a new user!

Thanks to the moderator who so kindly moved it for me.

Now that we've got all that out of the way, let's get back on topic, please folks.

Does anyone else feel ashamed about what we did in Iraq?

Thanks to the people that didn't jump on me and posted direct answers to my question!

[ScorpioPower]

it's common practice to bash new users on Internet forums

Yes, it is and isn't it extremely boring?! People who engage in it clearly have nothing better to do, DS.

In answer to your question, I'm a Brit, but we were there, too. So, YES, I am also ashamed about the way 'the West' behaved.

[SanukJoe]

I am irritated by the OP's use of the word WE.

As the operation Desert Storm was justified by all allied countries (Sadam occupied Kuwait and the allies kicked him out again) it was not the case with the Iraq invasion. This was a solely decided war crime by the US, based on fake CIA reports about mass destruction weapons in Iraq. As the CIA used to be in control of war areas (remember Vietnam and the CIA war in Lao) Mr. Commander in Chief Bush plus his entire staff of indoctrinated yeah-sayers backed by millions of (also indoctrinated) republicans decided to invade Iraq. Not alone but backed by allies. What to do as Bush knew very well that the CIA reports were fake. Telling lies to the allies that was the trick to do. And yes, English, Australian, French and other allies believed mister Bush on his blue eyes and sent troops to Iraq.

What amazed me and still amazes me is the lack of appropriate reaction of the allies when it came out that there were no mass destruction weapons at all and that the whole invasion was an act of aggression directed by the US.

Having said that I repeat that the whole war was a US decision based on lies and the US is totally responsible for all the lost lives.
Ashamed should feel those responsible in the US, not the soldiers who did what was ordered.
Ashamed should also feel those western governments who believed Mr. Bush.

When using the word WE the OP makes all of us accomplishes of that tremendous US aggressive act.

Texpat you are sinking below your own low level: Iraq was not liberated as you state, it was invaded and occupied.
If it was such a good act, why not "liberate" North Korea, Myanmar, Venezuela etcetera? You see what a highly intelligent remark you made?

Joe

[nkstan]

I'm sure the mods will place this in the right column and i wonder why a new guy would post such a controversial topic as his first post!

I don't feel any shame about what we did in Iraq,I think Saddam brought it upon himself and the Nation with his rhetoric,behavior and past history!He was perceived as a real threat by me as I believed that he had WMD's.as I believed that he was the Enemy of the West,as I believed that he would probably be supportive of Al Queda in their quest to terrorize the West!

I'm glad that Saddam was all BS,that there were no WMD's left because I'm not confident that we could have prevented their proliferation and use throughout the World!

The fact that no WMD's were found is really immaterial and the fact that the ''Green Zone'' was an excellent movie,doesn't convince me that their was a conspiracy to lie as an excuse to attack either!!

Saddam was given more than enough time and opportunity to reveal the destruction of those weapons he had possessed and used in the past.He left us no choice,but to attack ,as the only defense we had with all the possible destruction that we most probably would have suffered,if in fact he had , used or passed on the weapons to others!

It must be great for those liberals that opposed the attack,to be able to lambast The USA because there were no WMD's,which makes them look so right.

I don't feel ashamed,but think it is a shame that so many mistakes were made because of the lack of real human intelligence about the culture of the people and a lack of real human military intelligence was lacking.I think it was a shame that politicians such as Rumsfelt prosecuted the war in the manner they did instead of securing the country with enough troops initially,I think it a shame that wars are needed to settle things,I think it a shame that in every war ever fought,many many many mistakes have been made!

I would ask those that feel ashamed,will you also feel ashamed when we abandon Afghanistan,just as we did before?

[nkstan]

Sanuk Joe ,your statements about President Bush are only your opinion,not facts even though many people choose to believe the same as you!

[Charlieb]

Are you also ashamed of all the civilians killed in Japan and Germany during WWII?

War is a terrible thing and there are always casualties. Too bad any war has to be fought at all.

But, do you believe it is fate or coincidence that the U.S. has not been attacked since 9/11 or perhaps becuase we chose to meet them on their own turf?

A war is fought by thousand and thousands of people. When you get that many people together in any venue you will find the sadistic, the immoral and the cruel. But among thousands you will find far more people just trying to do a job.

I think our troops from *ALL* of the countries involved did one *HELL* of a job! I could never be ashamed of that!

[jackspratt]

Are you also ashamed of all the civilians killed in Japan and Germany during WWII?

War is a terrible thing and there are always casualties. Too bad any war has to be fought at all.

But, do you believe it is fate or coincidence that the U.S. has not been attacked since 9/11 or perhaps becuase we chose to meet them on their own turf?

A war is fought by thousand and thousands of people. When you get that many people together in any venue you will find the sadistic, the immoral and the cruel. But among thousands you will find far more people just trying to do a job.

I think our troops from *ALL* of the countries involved did one *HELL* of a job! I could never be ashamed of that!

WW2 is totally irrelevant to this debate Charlie.

Germany and Japan were both aggressors, and waged war on many other countries. Iraq was a threat only to its own people (as are several other un-invaded countries); Iran on occasion (backed of course by the USA); and the Bush family legacy.

And I don't think DS had the troops in mind when he was talking about the actions of the political pygmy's who initiated Operation Iraq Freedom. That is a red herring, and often bought up as a diversion from the real (political) issue.

Finally, it has been shown pretty conclusively that Iraq had little to do with the actions of Al Quaeda in the early part of this decade - and in fact Saddam was a natural enemy of those lunatics. Of course, the invasion has lead to an incremental growth in terrorism around the world (and corresponding shrinking of individual freedoms in western democracies) - well done George, Tony and Lil' John. =D> =D> =D>

[wiking]

Re: Does anyone else feel ashamed about what we did in Thailand !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!