kiwi girl dies of food poisoning

[wazza]

Swelling of the heart ....Ummm, not really a medical term as such, perhaps, engorgement of the heart muscle from Pulmonary Oedema ( fluid on the lungs, caused by a back flow by poor heart / pump) . People who have had heart attacks loose a % of their heart muscle so the pump doesnt eject the full amount of blood into the aorta, they get a back flow into the lungs , the peripheral body then absorbs this , ( swollen ankles and lower limbs ) but eventually the BLood Pressure , fluids etc give up and fluid ( oedema ) fills the upper airway and you see frothy bubbly oedema in the mouth , trachea, upper airways of the lungs and you literally drown. Its not the cause of death as I have said, its what kills you, the cause is why did it happen in the first place and only a post mortem with good pathology testing will identify that.

U see pulmonary oedema is a lot of deaths, but its not the root cause of the death, example, if u have a Chlorine exposure or a CO posioning , Pulm Oeadeam will be there, same as a drowning victim.

This is looking more like some form of food / consumption, with no physical link between the rooms and the external environment,

They may all have had a breakfast at some stage ? and the common link is the kitchen and its staff, I would be looking at E coli, Listeria,

Im also qualified in Food Safety Level 4 - UK - FSA and thats my angle on it. UHT milk contaminated ??

The staff need / must have a medical check.

[maaka]

BOB

check your PM...There is a police conference at chiangmai police at 3.00pm today to release the forensic reports and to resort faith in the tourist trade..a TV3 will be phoning you to ask if you will accompanying a tv cameraman to the confrence and ask some questions for Tv3

ALSO the families have been contacted and told of your/my offer of assistance, and they are supposedly going to make contact...

[BarnicaleBob]

Waiting for their call but at any rate I'll be there to ask questions.

[jackspratt]

This has now hit the Australian national broadcaster, the ABC.

Thai police pressed on mystery tourist deaths

Pressure is mounting on Thai authorities to explain the mysterious deaths of four people staying at the same hotel at popular tourist destination Chiang Mai.

A New Zealander backpacker, a retired British couple and a Thai tourist guide all died after staying at the Downtown Inn at Chiang Mai in the north of the country.

The deaths happened in the space of two weeks last month and authorities are under pressure from the families of the dead and from the tourist industry to explain what locals describe as a "strange coincidence".................

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011 ... ion=justin

[DermotC]

BB and Maaka, fair play to you guys!

But I ask, why oh why have the authorites not closed this place down until the reasons for the deaths are known!

[wazza]

Righto

world media pressure is now being applied ! Many will ask, why wasnt this done from day 1 of the notification, well we all know why. Slip it under the carpet and head in the sand attitude.

There will be a finding soon, as the Tourist Authorities want a sacrificial lamb for sure. Will they hang out one of their own.

Bring in Dr Pornthip from Bangkok , she is the only Forensic Pathologist with some credability as she takes on the governemt on many issues.

[wazza]

To assist Makka and his interest in this issue, plus the families , I replied directly to the ABC online, telling them about the previous deaths a few years ago from the same place,

lets hope they look into it a bit further, and publish a folow up ,

It seems that only international pressure, all be bad for Thailand , is the only way to get results.

As i said in my previous posts.

[maaka]

Rodger that Bob..yes best to go to that meeting anyway, as the families may ask for your assistance in the coming days, now that I have thrown our names into the hat..

good one Dermot..and good question, me thinks they feared the tourist trade would dry up if things got out..

Wazza, they gave me the medical term, but it was such a big word, and they said it so fast, and I had no paper or pen to write it down, but i will try get hold of it..WELL DONE WAZZA WITH ABC

sorry for any spelling mistakes fellas, but I am in between cities and dashing into internet shops along the way, trying to pull a number of parties together on this one, in a small time frame...

[21again]

21again's quote: One man's last name was Bingham, and the second man's last name was Powell. The third man announced that his last name was Bingham-Powell. None were related in any way. (Mysteries of the Unexplained)
Well Bingham-Powell: When the last time you have seen a MAN with a hyphenated last name, it is mostly married women who do that. He very well could have been telling a lie, maybe just to be funny. Like I said, I don't believe in co-incidences. Think of it this way, who would you rather have investigating a case someone who believed in co-incidences or someone who did not? Any good cop never believes in co-incidences.

Maurice Christopher Jones-Drew (born March 23, 1985) is a professional American football player who currently plays running back for the Jacksonville Jaguars of the National Football League.

Michael Anthony Sims-Walker (born Michael Anthony Walker on November 21, 1984 in Orlando, Florida) is an American football wide receiver who is currently a free agent of the National Football League.

Thats two how many more would you like.?
When you and Doctor Watson have finished with your investigations let us know the result.
You come across someone more weird everyday. 55555555555555555555555555555555

[BarnicaleBob]

I never got the call from them but I did go to the police headquarters. Upon my arrival at 3:00 PM I had to go from on office to another to try and find where the meeting was. After 20 minutes I finally found out that the meeting was being held at another police headquarters on the other side of town. By the time I got there the meeting was just wrapping up. I did get to speak with the TV3 contractor Steve Sandford and he took a short video of me interviewing the police spokesman and then one of me talking to a health department director. While speaking with the health department director I asked if they had taken hair samples from the victims to run toxicology tests on and he stated no but thought it might be a good idea to and will look into it. All the other toxicology reports came back with negative results. It was never made clear if the other toxicology reports were just blood tests or if the included tissue tests as well. At this point I would like to suggest Ms. Carter's family try to get the other two living victims to give some hair samples to a NZ lab and have them run toxicology tests. The hair samples need to be cut from the skin surface from the top of the hair follicles root. I have my doubts about the quality of tests run in Thailand. Tomorrow I am meeting with one of the senior police commanders to see if I can talk him into giving me copies of the three police reports which is something not normally allowed. In the coming days I will also attempt to get copies of the toxicology reports and a list of evidence taken from the scene. I also found the tour operator and interviewed today and she helped me confirm my time line of the three NZ girls activities with her. So I now know that it was during of the night of the 2nd to the morning of the 3rd that the girls became ill. The 3rd is the same morning the body of the first victim was found in the room next door to the girls. This tells me whatever caused these two deaths happened the same night to people in rooms next to each other. It just took the young and healthy girl longer to die than the 47 year old woman who had other health issues and less resistance.
I think somebody on here said another American girl died in the same hotel a few years ago, so far I can’t find anything on that. Anyone know the date this happened and maybe the victim’s name?
One last thing, I went back to the hotel again today and asked if room 516 and 518 could be rented today and they said yes, no problem. Another thing I noticed is that room 423 the first victims room and the other two rooms are all on the west side of the hotel and close to each other. I took a photo of the rooms from the outside and noticed there is large tree below the rooms, can anyone identify this tree for me, I'm just trying to eliminate another possible source.

[wazza]

BB i supose another line of interest is, , do they have a very disgruntled ex employee with a grudge ??

The toxicology is a good start and why wasnt it done at first, Cycnide will be picked up etc.

Gastric content at the PM also.

One thing is for sure, its going pear shaped for the original investigating team, who havent looked deep.

[maaka]

Bob I have sent a PM, but will also just add some words here to get members in the loop of this story...
sorry about no call from the tv crew, typically ruddy tv, but good to see you did hook up with the cameraman, and add some content , which hopefully the families will see later this week...

it was ME who said another person died at the same hotel some years ago, and american woman..I was told this by the TV producer yesterday..she stated that the dead womans husband called the tv station after he had seen the doco about the kiwi girls..I will try and get his contact details, I will try and get all you request..give me a 24hrs ok...

yes you gardening buffs...a name of that tree in Bobs pic could be important, any ideas...

[maaka]

Bob this is unconfirmed, other than on a thai law site and thaivisa.com, that an american women name Babara Lee died in chiangmai of food poisoning on Jan 11, 2011. I have no other details as yet to confirm this, or if this woman is the same woman the TV Network told me about..

good to see you now have a cover as a news reporter, wink wink,.. should get you in a number of doors I hope.

[BarnicaleBob]

Here is the headline from the New Zealand Herald,
Mariam Soraya Vorster, left, died mysteriously in Chiang Mai just weeks before New Zealander Sarah Carter, right. Photos / Supplied
A fifth tourist has died in Chiang Mai, Thailand, in circumstances eerily similar to New Zealander Sarah Carter's mysterious death - which health officials initially blamed on food poisoning.

American Mariam Soraya Vorster, a 33-year-old from Seattle working as a guide in Chiang Mai, died on January 11 - just over three weeks before 23-year-old Sarah died.

Ms Vorster's husband Tony Pandolo told the Herald his wife was perfectly fit and healthy and became sick with symptoms of food poisoning before she died.

[maaka]

well done Bob..I had the dates right but the name wrong, so now we can progress as you alluded to me in PM..be interesting to find out if she stayed at the Downtown Inn for a starter, and what room..I am working between PM and here..any senstive,or private family info I will PM you

[arjay]

I don't suppose that tree with the red berries could be hanging over an area where they prepare food could it?

[maaka]

it is a good question ajay. there are a number of toxic trees in thailand, some deadly, so I have been looking into that..whether it is berries, or scent from the flowers sucked into the air con, or some such thing..

[BarnicaleBob]

I don't suppose that tree with the red berries could be hanging over an area where they prepare food could it?

The tree is on the other side of the building from the kitchen so you can rule that out. I still don't know what kind of tree it is, any input would be welcome as it sits just below all three rooms of the four victims.

[BarnicaleBob]

it is a good question ajay. there are a number of toxic trees in thailand, some deadly, so I have been looking into that..whether it is berries, or scent from the flowers sucked into the air con, or some such thing..

We had low and comfortable temperatures on Feb. 2 and 3 (the time when the victim contracted whatever they got) and they may have had the windows open. Again, that is another reason I would like to interview the two surviving girls.

[Galee]

I assume gas from the sewers has been ruled out.