execution-style shooting in Ubon???

[cookie]

Two Lao-Americans killed at border

(Bangkokpost.com from Agencies)

Two Americans of Lao origin were shot dead execution-style in Thailand while returning from their homeland, police said Thursday.

Soukanh Visathep, 65, a former Lao government police officer, and Somvang Keomanyvong, 61, a former army officer, were shot and killed by a lone gunman as they arrived by bus at a northeastern Thai-Lao border crossing on Wednesday evening.

Both men were shot at point blank range in the head in front of frightened onlookers at Ubon Ratchathani's busy bus terminal. They died at the scene.

The victims arrived in Thailand from Portland, United States with their families on Nov 17 and went straight to their hometown of Pakse in Champasak province, southern Laos, across the Mekong River from Ubon Ratchathani province.

They re-entered Thailand on Wednesday, and were headed to Ubon Ratchathani airport, where they planned to fly to Bangkok and on to the United States.

Several Lao-Americans and Laos citizens believed to be against the Laos communist government have been shot dead in Thai border provinces.

Laos has denied any involvement in the killing of several anti-government activists, including a Lao-American couple shot dead in January.

Police refused to speculate on whether Wednesday's victims were anti-government activists, and said they had not yet arrested anyone in connection with the double killing.

[BKKSTAN]

They caught the the contractors that killed the couple in Nong Khai a year ago.They claimed that they were paid 100,000 baht for the hit by the Lao gov't ,that denied it!
I think the Lao gov't can do what ever it pleases to Lao individuals without any repercussions!They don't allow any political unrest to develop at all!BANG!

[muscle]

I think the Lao gov't can do what ever it pleases to Lao individuals without any repercussions!They don't allow any political unrest to develop at all!BANG!

As if the Thai, US, Russian or British governments are any different? What's the difference between a little radioactive poisoning and a "double tap"?
There is a safety that I feel in Laos that I feel no where else. Maybe it comes from knowing that someone isactually in control of the country I don't make problems and act like a good farang, no one bothers me. The ones who make problems, get problems.
I am very glad we will be able to move back there soon.

[Bump]

That makes about five or six now, including the two I knwe but for some reaon were never publisised.

[muscle]

That makes about five or six now, including the two I knwe but for some reaon were never publisised.

Sorry for any offense if it was someone you knew. My disrespect for governments and politicians is universal.
The peacefull quality of Vientiane has an odd quality about it, but I do feel safer there than any place else.

[Bump]

No the guys I knew were killed two years ago, both now American citizens of Lao decent. They were really no one special but both had worked for the CIA during the war. But definetly contract killings.

[BKKSTAN]

muscle says:

As if the Thai, US, Russian or British governments are any different? What's the difference between a little radioactive poisoning and a "double tap"?

Are you actually comparing these gov'ts with the Lao gov't,a one party gov't w/o the checks and balances for Human rights!
I agree that all gov'ts have clandestine operations,but I think it is ridiculous to compare the ability and consequences of dissent against the gov't between the USA and Laos.
Since you feel safer living there than anywhere else,I hope your stated disrespect for gov't doesn't cause you any problems!
I personally believe it is a far reach to compare the everyday living conditions regarding your basic liberties and human rights to Laos!The limitations on ''free speech'' are dramatically different IMO!
Maybe a police intervention into your staying quarters to check your official marriage status will give thought to your above statement!Hope everything goes well for you there!

[muscle]

My marriage is official. I met with my villiage headman before moving into the home rented for us by my family from a high level government employee. The headman lived next door. Was I being placed and watched because of my background? Without a doubt. Many of the family members are government employees and one is quite well placed. It was obvious from where were were living that eyes were on us. So what? I have nothing to fear as I am doing nothing illegal. We had little concern about theft or personal injury. My contact with government officials was friendly and on a daily peronal basis. Much more civil than the "civil servants" I dealt with in the US.
Free speech? When was the last time you were in the US? As Bush says, "You are either fer us or agin' us." There is some free speech for you. Try saying no to the Draconian measures instituted in airports and see what happens to you. The idea that the US is the land of free speech is naive. I worked at the Pentagon before retirement. You either fell in lockstep with Field Marshal Rummy or you faced the music. There was no "loyal opposition" permitted.
Disrespect for government does not indicate stupidity in dealing with them. The rules for behavior in Lao are clearly defined which makes them much easier to deal with. I have no social issues ax to grind so there is little chance I will complain about not having my soapbox in the public square to preach from.
The Republicrats and Demicams just as well may be one party for all they accomplish. Either way, the public be damned.

[Dakoda]

My marriage is official. I met with my villiage headman before moving into the home rented for us by my family from a high level government employee. The headman lived next door. Was I being placed and watched because of my background? Without a doubt. Many of the family members are government employees and one is quite well placed. It was obvious from where were were living that eyes were on us. So what? I have nothing to fear as I am doing nothing illegal. We had little concern about theft or personal injury. My contact with government officials was friendly and on a daily peronal basis. Much more civil than the "civil servants" I dealt with in the US.
Free speech? When was the last time you were in the US? As Bush says, "You are either fer us or agin' us." There is some free speech for you. Try saying no to the Draconian measures instituted in airports and see what happens to you. The idea that the US is the land of free speech is naive. I worked at the Pentagon before retirement. You either fell in lockstep with Field Marshal Rummy or you faced the music. There was no "loyal opposition" permitted.
Disrespect for government does not indicate stupidity in dealing with them. The rules for behavior in Lao are clearly defined which makes them much easier to deal with. I have no social issues ax to grind so there is little chance I will complain about not having my soapbox in the public square to preach from.
The Republicrats and Demicams just as well may be one party for all they accomplish. Either way, the public be damned.

amen to that

[BKKSTAN]

My marriage is official. I met with my villiage headman before moving into the home rented for us by my family from a high level government employee. The headman lived next door. Was I being placed and watched because of my background? Without a doubt. Many of the family members are government employees and one is quite well placed. It was obvious from where were were living that eyes were on us. So what? I have nothing to fear as I am doing nothing illegal. We had little concern about theft or personal injury. My contact with government officials was friendly and on a daily peronal basis. Much more civil than the "civil servants" I dealt with in the US.
Free speech? When was the last time you were in the US? As Bush says, "You are either fer us or agin' us." There is some free speech for you. Try saying no to the Draconian measures instituted in airports and see what happens to you. The idea that the US is the land of free speech is naive. I worked at the Pentagon before retirement. You either fell in lockstep with Field Marshal Rummy or you faced the music. There was no "loyal opposition" permitted.
Disrespect for government does not indicate stupidity in dealing with them. The rules for behavior in Lao are clearly defined which makes them much easier to deal with. I have no social issues ax to grind so there is little chance I will complain about not having my soapbox in the public square to preach from.
The Republicrats and Demicams just as well may be one party for all they accomplish. Either way, the public be damned.

amen to that

Posted and seconded by true expats

[BKKSTAN]

The rules for behavior in Lao are clearly defined which makes them much easier to deal with.

Less freedom of choice definitely makes for clearly defined rules!Easier to deal with probably has a lot to do with the individuals thinking,but in such a strict society an injustice is not so easily righted if a mistake is made by the individual or ruling authority,in that case being in the USA might be better
Time incountry will be the best tell!I wish you all the best and no problems!

[muscle]

With respect, it is understandable that many people have issues with the Lao government. I have read a lot of history concerning the Liberation and spoken with many people on both sides who went through it. It was a tough time but the irrepressable spirit of the Lao people prevailed. I respect them greatly.
After nearly 30 years of living in the highly defined social structure of military life, Lao does not appear to be any more rigid than what I have been doing most of my adult life. Although there may be an issue in the future, I have yet to find a situation where I lacked a freedom of choice. My only choice at this point is to have some relative solitude so I can tend to my injuries and enjoy my family.
I was already informed by the official censor (a family friend) that anything I would want to publish would need to be cleared through them. I'm not writing social commentary, so that is no problem.
I do have a problem with the human rights issues generated by Abu Gharib and Gitmo. I have been to Gitmo. A good friend, now retired medically, was a medical officer at Abu during the incidents and will be testifying against Rummy. I believe the hearing is next week in a Virginia courtroom. A close friend, who was the Pentagon watch officer for Abu is now at Abu fact finding for a year. While we are not talking Concentration Camp numbers, we are dealing with similar methodology. Some very bad things have happened and someone needs to be held accountable.
Here is an example for you: Have you ever had an IV inserted? Does it hurt? How many tries will the medic or nurse make before they call a physician to do a cutdown? The answer for standard practice is 3. So, if a medic is ordered to keep sticking ten or more times, knowing that they will not get a successful IV start, does this constitute torture? It would in an American hospital.
There are those that will say that any practice needed to save a single American life is warranted. That is a tough one to debate and I don't have the time today to even start on that one.
This is not how America should operate. It puts us lower than those countries we accuse of Human Rights violations. Our standards and practices should be higher and those that violate them should be punished. I realize that is naive in a country run by the highest campaign contributors, but values and ethics were an integral parts of my education. The behavior of the US in Iraq has led me to "vote with my feet" almost to the point of turning in my blue passport for a Lao one. I was asked by a Lao official if I would like to become a Lao citizen. I am waiting to clear up my VA, SSDI and retirement issues before I make that decision.
Not an easy or quick decision to make.
Thanks for the engaging dialogue and discussion. It keeps the mind sharp to debate with intelligent people who have the experience of travel. Thanks.

[BKKSTAN]

I think I understand your thoughts and feelings about our country and the events surrounding Abu and Gitmo!

As I am sure you know,our fighting forces are young and probably frustrated about their lack of effectiveness in their assigned mission!That,fear and loss of buddies breeds some negative reactions throughout the force causing alot of criminal actions and thinking that maybe ,in the mind of the perpetrators,justifies their behavior.''War is hell''and sometimes all the fighting is just for each others survival,not patriotism!

I think a lot of our USA actions have been kind of a knee jerk reaction from the fear instilled by 9/11 type of events.We are not used to having our ''comfort level'' so traumatized by war on our home territory!The negativism about our actions has developed over time because in hindsight we have seen many failed plans and the constant media focus on those events!

One thing for sure that I relate to and sometimes still resemble(hopefully it is diminishing )is the ''arrogance'' that we Americans show by thinking we understand other cultures so much and that our ''way'' is best for all!

It is hard to maintain ''high standards'' of conduct,when your opposition is so vicious!I definitely agree with you that it is imperative that we do maintain ''higher standards''than them.However I also believe we have to be realistic and adjust prudently our system to combat threats that we never perceived or experienced before.It seems realistic to me to institute racial profiling into security measures for the short term good of most of our citizenry.Especially if sound restitution and compensation for undue hardships are made to the innocent!

Your analogy of more than 3 IV starts is well taken,but as A Psych. Nurse for the state of Calif. the last 15 years before retirement.I will state that I have seen very poor patient care given in state hospitals for a variety of bureaucratic reasons and a general lack of true ''care giving concern''as ''burn out'' entrenches itself!Some ,I could term ''torturous''!''Whistle blowing'' to these events is effectively blocked as the administrators are all about ''clean sheets''and don't want ''a mess''!

It is hard to not become cynical,when everywhere you look,it is hard to see an ''inherent goodness'' in man that can be maintained,including myself!How does one ''judge'' the actions of others,when we know our own ''secrets''!Never the less,we all seem to try!

I think one of the things that makes Nong Khai so relaxed and relatively comfortable culturally for me and other falangs,is the influence of the LAO people that are such a big part of our populus and interwoven into our area.They are generally very nice people,without the submerged resentment held by many Thais!

I find many of your posts challenging and therefore very interesting!Glad you are onboard,look forward to meeting you before you move to Laos