Gun Control

[vlad]

Like you said earlier statts if shooting kids in a primary Scholl doesn't change their mind on gun control what will ??

[fatbob]

It is really totally unbelievable, 11,500 gun related deaths this year, over 15,000 last year, yet nothing is done, I guess if the world is to become a better place maybe in 2018 they can achieve 250 million.

[GT93]

As much as I think it is as Vlad and similarly minded posters call it, this is a matter for the Americans and their political system. There are a variety of pushes and pulls in there and like any country the most sensible solution doesn't always pop out. Hopefully something good will come of this tragedy.

[stattointhailand]

As much as I think it is as Vlad and similarly minded posters call it, this is a matter for the Americans and their political system. There are a variety of pushes and pulls in there and like any country the most sensible solution doesn't always pop out. Hopefully something good will come of this tragedy.

Ah, now I see ....... When it's in America it's is a matter for the Americans and their political system .... right

And

If it's anywhere else in the world ....... err, it's a matter for the Americans and their political system or be prepared for the consequences

[GT93]

No no, that's not my hymn sheet at all. I generally tend to resist American or any imperialism. Imperialistic thinking is so ingrained in farang thinking that it can be difficult at times to detect. I'm a fan of self-determination.

I think public safety issues in the US are a matter for Americans unless they affect people outside the US. If I was American, I'd hoard guns. It's different in my country so I don't.

[mathusalah80]

There's a process for amending the Constitution. If Americans wanted it changed, they'd change it.

Other than on this topic you have demonstrated yourself to be a person of intelligence but, with respect, surely you would not truly expect such a naïve statement to be taken seriously?
Is it really your contention that you honestly believe, hand on your heart, that if a non corrupt referendum, was conducted in the USA, (would that be possible! ), allowing THE PEOPLE TO DECIDE, that the majority would favour retention of the gun laws, in their present form?
Personally, despite all indications to the contrary, I have enough faith in the commonsense , and the love of the average American for their compatriots, and for the wellbeing of their family and country, to believe you are gravely mistaken, (perhaps misguided), arising from your obvious passion for guns.
I plead guilty to the fact that, each time this topic comes up for debate, I am left with the conviction that the Constitution is relegated to the status of merely a tool to justify the stance of the pro-gunners', rather than as an expression of pride in the "Constitution" per se.
Little doubt the Country's forefathers are turning in their graves as, month in and month out, they are joined there by thousands of Americans who owe their deaths directly to the misuse ,or deliberate misinterpretation, of the intended terms of The "Constitution", (as related to the bearing of arms AS KNOWN OR FORSEEN AT THAT TIME), which they wrote with such high hopes.
But as Lone Star happily wrote, debate is never going to change the status quo. Compounding his happiness is the certainty that those with a commercial interest in the arms industry, coupled with the army of individual gun fanatics, will never ever allow any amendment to the constitution, (as Lone Star knows perfectly well ).
So, end this useless debate and await news of the inevitable new record number of deaths of innocent citizens; which I doubt will be long in coming.

[Lone Star]

There's a process for amending the Constitution. If Americans wanted it changed, they'd change it.

Other than on this topic you have demonstrated yourself to be a person of intelligence but, with respect, surely you would not truly expect such a naïve statement to be taken seriously?
Is it really your contention that you honestly believe, hand on your heart, that if a non corrupt referendum, was conducted in the USA, (would that be possible! ), allowing THE PEOPLE TO DECIDE, that the majority would favour retention of the gun laws, in their present form?
Personally, despite all indications to the contrary, I have enough faith in the commonsense , and the love of the average American for their compatriots, and for the wellbeing of their family and country, to believe you are gravely mistaken, (perhaps misguided), arising from your obvious passion for guns.
I plead guilty to the fact that, each time this topic comes up for debate, I am left with the conviction that the Constitution is relegated to the status of merely a tool to justify the stance of the pro-gunners', rather than as an expression of pride in the "Constitution" per se.
Little doubt the Country's forefathers are turning in their graves as, month in and month out, they are joined there by thousands of Americans who owe their deaths directly to the misuse ,or deliberate misinterpretation, of the intended terms of The "Constitution", (as related to the bearing of arms AS KNOWN OR FORSEEN AT THAT TIME), which they wrote with such high hopes.
But as Lone Star happily wrote, debate is never going to change the status quo. Compounding his happiness is the certainty that those with a commercial interest in the arms industry, coupled with the army of individual gun fanatics, will never ever allow any amendment to the constitution, (as Lone Star knows perfectly well ).
So, end this useless debate and await news of the inevitable new record number of deaths of innocent citizens; which I doubt will be long in coming.

If you think all of that, then you're not a student of American Society or the Constitution.

I stated that debate would not change the Constitution. The People will change it if they want it changed. Despite the fact that innocent people are killed at the hands of imperfect people in an imperfect free society, Americans still prefer having their guns to defend themselves against tyranny -- which was the original intention of the 2nd Amendment. Not to hunt.

The Founders and Framers provided a means for amending the Constitution. It has been used for things as simple as adding a woman's right to vote, people 18 years old to vote, term limits for presidents -- and the last Amendment, number 27: Delays laws affecting Congressional salary from taking effect until after the next election of representatives.

I think most would agree that if things of that nature can be amended in the Constitution, then if Americans want changes to the 2nd Amendment, they can make it happen. My money is on Americans wanting to keep their guns.

Most Americans I know don't care what other countries think about our guns. It's not about them. It's about us. Most don't live within our borders, and like here in Thailand, if someone doesn't like it, they can leave -- or not come at all. If guns strike fear in the heart of anyone, I would encourage them to visit and live someplace where they can be comfortable.

[vlad]

Lonestar you cannot debate the constitution when your own congress and president will not upset the RFA. Congress even voted out a law to ban silencers ?? Surely you must look at yourselves and wonder why are all the mass shootings happening in your country or how you can stop them? maybe like most of the posters say it's too late to stop as its born into you at a young age your right to bear arms.

[Lone Star]

Lonestar you cannot debate the constitution when your own congress and president will not upset the RFA. Congress even voted out a law to ban silencers ?? Surely you must look at yourselves and wonder why are all the mass shootings happening in your country or how you can stop them? maybe like most of the posters say it's too late to stop as its born into you at a young age your right to bear arms.

I don't know what the RFA is.

Slavery was abolished in the Constitution. Alcohol was abolished in the Constitution (but later reinstated). Those were born into Americans at a young age.

Americans will give up their guns when they think they can trust their federal government. One of the only reasons why Americans haven't been steamrolled by the globalists is because we have guns.

[SJP17]

Lonestar you cannot debate the constitution when your own congress and president will not upset the RFA. Congress even voted out a law to ban silencers ?? Surely you must look at yourselves and wonder why are all the mass shootings happening in your country or how you can stop them? maybe like most of the posters say it's too late to stop as its born into you at a young age your right to bear arms.

I don't know what the RFA is.

Slavery was abolished in the Constitution. Alcohol was abolished in the Constitution (but later reinstated). Those were born into Americans at a young age.

Americans will give up their guns when they think they can trust their federal government. One of the only reasons why Americans haven't been steamrolled by the globalists is because we have guns.

He means the National Rifle Association not RFA

[mathusalah80]

There's a process for amending the Constitution. If Americans wanted it changed, they'd change it.

But as Lone Star happily wrote, debate is never going to change the status quo. Compounding his happiness is the certainty that those with a commercial interest in the arms industry, coupled with the army of individual gun fanatics, will never ever allow any amendment to the constitution, (as Lone Star knows perfectly well ).
So, end this useless debate and await news of the inevitable new record number of deaths of innocent citizens; which I doubt will be long in coming.

If you think all of that, then you're not a student of American Society or the Constitution....Not sure by what convoluted thinking, you arrive at that convenient, but totally erroneous, conclusion

Most Americans I know don't care what other countries think about our guns. It's not about them. It's about us. ..... if someone doesn't like it, they can leave -- or not come at all. If guns strike fear in the heart of anyone, I would encourage them to visit and live someplace where they can be comfortable.

I agree that, unfortunately, I believe you have probably provided a true & fair summary of how little "most Americans you know" care about the opinions of the rest of the world , on guns or any other topic, for that matter.
[/b]

Probably time to close this thread which, as has been the case with previous threads on this unfortunate topic, is now simply going around in repetitive circles.

[stattointhailand]

May be at some time in the future mat, the Federation of Intergalactic nations, will pass a resolution and tell America that if they don't Amend the gun laws by midnight they will have no option but to bomb the sh*t out of them ..... as they say what goes round comes round

[deankham]

A little bit of topic but anyway, for the past few weeks the Prisoners from Udon jail have been doing some hard labor on Soi Si Suk cleaning out the main drains. Anyway I've been watching them slowly working their way down from the Soi and wondering what, if anything, would happen when they reached the Gun shop near the Police Station!

Funnily enough I drove past as they were doing this section to find half a dozen inmates looking through the locked outer shutters of the Gun shop as the shop keeper sat inside. Was a funny sight. Not sure if the Gun shop owner decided to lock himself in or if the Prison wardens asked him to.

[vlad]

I believe in a good debate is a fair rebate so will our American friends on the Map tell us how they would stop these Atrocities happening again, and are they looking at how Trump will surely have to answer some of the questions that should be coming his way as this is the worst shooting in their History. Let's not have it's our rights, or it's our constitution how are you going to stop it ??

[tigerryan]

Brits and their obsession with American gun laws is something I completely don't get and don't care about anymore. I don't know if its nature or nurture we are different people and I am glad that I am not British. I have been asked about it by a drunk brit in a bar 1000 times in the last 30 years. The shooting in Las Vegas hits home for me, those were my people and through the wonders on Facebook I distantly know two people that were there and one of my Army team mates went to Q course selection with a guy that lost his wife. With that being said there is no "solution" to this problem evil psycos don't care about law. I can assure you that country music fans and their families are not screaming out for a "solution" we all just want to know WTF this guy was thinking if at all possible. This event was awful, people are morning this tragedy but they know Its part of living in a free society and sh+t happens. Every guy I know has five plus firearms guns are everywhere and fortunately sh+t like this rarely happens in the part of the country where my clan of brothers resides. I don't give a F what happens in Chicago,LA, New Jersey, Detroit, Miami and that is where all statistics come from. If a distant political majority or minority come after our guns and our blessed constitutional right the union will fail to survive its just that simple.....so it wont happen...... end of lesson move along British people.

[trekkertony]

I wonder if James Maddison would have proposed the right to bear arms as per the Bill of Rights if he had the capacity at the time to forsee the carnage being created by those who use their inaliable right to bear arms to butcher the lives of others?

[fatbob]

Brits and their obsession with American gun laws is something I completely don't get and don't care about anymore. I don't know if its nature or nurture we are different people and I am glad that I am not British. I have been asked about it by a drunk brit in a bar 1000 times in the last 30 years. The shooting in Las Vegas hits home for me, those were my people and through the wonders on Facebook I distantly know two people that were there and one of my Army team mates went to Q course selection with a guy that lost his wife. With that being said there is no "solution" to this problem evil psycos don't care about law. I can assure you that country music fans and their families are not screaming out for a "solution" we all just want to know WTF this guy was thinking if at all possible. This event was awful, people are morning this tragedy but they know Its part of living in a free society and sh+t happens. Every guy I know has five plus firearms guns are everywhere and fortunately sh+t like this rarely happens in the part of the country where my clan of brothers resides. I don't give a F what happens in Chicago,LA, New Jersey, Detroit, Miami and that is where all statistics come from. If a distant political majority or minority come after our guns and our blessed constitutional right the union will fail to survive its just that simple.....so it wont happen...... end of lesson move along British people.

Sorry but there is a solution, but with an attitude like that there definitely isn't. Australia, the great country it is had a solution that has worked...never say never.

[Lone Star]

I believe in a good debate is a fair rebate so will our American friends on the Map tell us how they would stop these Atrocities happening again, and are they looking at how Trump will surely have to answer some of the questions that should be coming his way as this is the worst shooting in their History. Let's not have it's our rights, or it's our constitution how are you going to stop it ??

In an imperfect free society, there will always be imperfect humans who find ways to kill.

Every month in Chicago, where some of the strictest gun control laws exist in America, thugs kill each other at the same monthly rate as what occurred in one night in Las Vegas. In Chicago, the law-abiding citizen has no easy access to a firearm to protect themselves, and they have a mayor who provides sanctuary to illegal criminal aliens. Chicago is not the only city like this, but it is among the worst. I want law-abiding citizens -- many millions of them who act responsibly with firearms -- to have access to being able to protect themselves.

And stop blaming the NRA for this crap. When was the last time any of these deranged killers were linked to that organization? NEVER. The media just uses them as a whipping boy every time some gun crime is committed. The NRA is a group of responsible gun owners who believe in the 2nd Amendment and work hard to defend it. They also promote responsible gun ownership and use.

In a free and imperfect society, cars and trucks aren't removed from our streets when they're used to purposely kill and maim, and driving those are privileges, not rights.

My response is that there is no way to stop a deranged killer from carrying out his/her mayhem in a free and imperfect society -- and it doesn't even happen in countries where no guns are allowed at all. They always find a way, since their mission consumes their every thought while we go about our daily routines.

[Lone Star]

Brits and their obsession with American gun laws is something I completely don't get and don't care about anymore.

...

With that being said there is no "solution" to this problem evil psycos don't care about law.

...

This event was awful, people are morning this tragedy but they know Its part of living in a free society and sh+t happens. Every guy I know has five plus firearms guns are everywhere and fortunately sh+t like this rarely happens in the part of the country where my clan of brothers resides. I don't give a F what happens in Chicago,LA, New Jersey, Detroit, Miami and that is where all statistics come from. If a distant political majority or minority come after our guns and our blessed constitutional right the union will fail to survive its just that simple.....so it wont happen...... end of lesson move along British people.

I am in agreement with this. We have pretty much hit the same chords in this discussion.

Additionally, I'm not obsessed with the UK NOT having guns. It's their society. They are entitled to live as they wish. None of my business. I don't live there or vote there.

[stattointhailand]

"With that being said there is no "solution" to this problem evil psycos don't care about law."

That is perfectly true, except for the fact that America seems to have far more than it's fair share of "evil psyco's"

Perhaps that's down to the fact that America prefers to spend its billions on guns instead of a healthcare system that would identify (and treat) a considerable number (can't say all) of these "evil psyco's" BEFORE they got to the stage of mass murder

Can't say I have seen too many reports of 50 killed by evil psyco with steak knife or 250 injured by evil psyco with a bit of broken glass

" Brits and their obsession with American gun laws is something I completely don't get"

Sorry to burst your bubble tigerryan but its NOT the Brits that have an obsession with your gun laws ........... it's virtually the whole world outside of America, its just that the Brits try a bit harder to get their Prodigal son to see the error of his ways