Jeffrey Epstein and Prince Andrew

[tamada]

See the girls father has joined in now saying what a bad person the prince is .Got me wondering what he was doing while his teenage daughter was packing her bag to go flying off in the rich guys plane for a holiday on his island .Maybe he didn't see her going for all the dollar signs getting in his eyes , or did he think she was going shopping ?Like father like kid I suppose, must be very traumatic taking 500$ when you thought you would get more .

I guess when victim blaming fails to satisfy, one can always rely on blaming the victim's family. It's probably very easy when you think you know the alleged perpetrator better than the alleged victim. Or maybe there's something deeper, more personal that's driving this kinsmanship with the Prince? A 'There but for the Grace of God go I" sort of introspective?

But I guess ol' grumpy was never tempted to do something illicit for a few extra bob when he was a lad, eh? Probably too busy being the good altar boy.

[tamada]

A question or two for the forum Royalists.

If what Ms Giuffre alleges in her suit is correct, and can be proven ie:

Her legal claim alleges she “was compelled by express or implied threats by Epstein, [Ghislaine] Maxwell, and/or Prince Andrew to engage in sexual acts with Prince Andrew, and feared death or physical injury to herself or another and other repercussions for disobeying Epstein, Maxwell, and Prince Andrew due to their powerful connections, wealth and authority”. It further alleges that the prince knew she was a sex-trafficking victim and that she has suffered – and continues to suffer – “significant emotional and psychological distress and harm”.
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/202 ... appen-next

and

Her lawsuit alleges that “Prince Andrew’s actions constitute sexual offenses” including first- and third-degree rape, citing the New York penal code.
https://nypost.com/2021/08/13/virginia- ... x-assault/

What, if anything, should her remedy be?

And is there any indication that her father has benefited financially from her previous conduct, or will do so from this action?

OG and KP, two royalist bookends or two misogynist peas in a pod?

And to think we have a lurking shadow member telling other forums that nothing exciting ever really happens on UM 'cept the weekly shopping bargains at Makro, what's happening at the Viking Bar and being called names.

[GT93]

I suspect the idiot Prince had intercourse with many of the other young women entangled in Epstein's orbit. Fortunately for the royal idiot, most of them won't have realized who the hell he was.

The litigation is in New York so if any damages are awarded they will be sky high. I suspect we'll see a confidential settlement where the Prince is still able to deny liability. I expect he'll be forking out millions to get that.

[Drunk Monkey]

If it isnt conclusively proven that HRH was guilty of any wrong doing i would hope this woman would be tarred n feathered at the very least.

DM

[stattointhailand]

Perhaps all those tapes that nice Mr Epstein had made and locked away in his safe (no doubt now in the possession of the authorities or someone who will benefit from handing them over and being removed from them) will show quite clearly how much threatening took place. I suspect she would not try this approach if she had half a thought that there may be evidence to prove she was a willing participant.

[Old Grumpy]

But I guess ol' grumpy was never tempted to do something illicit for a few extra bob when he was a lad, eh? Probably too busy being the good altar boy.

Not far wrong Tam, I was a choir boy at my local church, got 2 shillings a week for church services and an extra 2/6d for singing at weddings, nice little earner while it lasted but unfortunately my other tempting sin , then and now , was wine and the vicar caught me swigging from the communal bottle, had to take up another source of income then, so got a window cleaning round .could tell you a few tales about that too but I signed a NDA so Mum's the word .

[jackspratt]

If it isnt conclusively proven that HRH was guilty of any wrong doing i would hope this woman would be tarred n feathered at the very least.

DM

No need for conclusive proof. In NY civil cases, the evidentiary standard is "preponderance of evidence" ie more than 50%.

As Ms Giuffre is now living in Australia, she is in no danger of being tarred and feathered whichever way the case goes. Of course, she would be well advised to cross Udon Thani off her travel bucket list once COVID normalises.

93 is on the money when he suggests a confidential settlement is the probable outcome. ADMIN may have an opinion on that.

[stattointhailand]

Only if all known copies of the tapes have been identified/purchased and destroyed ....... perhaps GM is being kept alive because they cant locate some of the evidence that needs destroying

[Drunk Monkey]

Seems quite a lot of UM members have already hung drawn n quartered HRH ... innocent until proven guilty ?? .. not if you guys are on the jury

i thought the prince covered all issues pertaining to this incident quite well in the TV interview he did several months ago..

DM

[stattointhailand]

Seems quite a lot of UM members have already hung drawn n quartered HRH ... innocent until proven guilty ?? .. not if you guys are on the jury

i thought the prince covered all issues pertaining to this incident quite well in the TV interview he did several months ago..

DM

Give him is due, he did manage to stop short of uttering the phrase "It's a fair cop" but not too far short

[jackspratt]

Seems quite a lot of UM members have already hung drawn n quartered HRH ... innocent until proven guilty ?? .. not if you guys are on the jury

A few other members seem to have come to a similar conclusion about Ms Giuffre.

[Old Grumpy]

Seems quite a lot of UM members have already hung drawn n quartered HRH ... innocent until proven guilty ?? .. not if you guys are on the jury

i thought the prince covered all issues pertaining to this incident quite well in the TV interview he did several months ago..

DM

I am not for either party, just that I can't see it's such a big deal either way, man pays for sex with a young woman, not a child as the broadsheets keep saying, she sells her pussy for money .Guess most of us old guys have been down that street at sometime in our younger days , the only difference here she can smell a bigger pay out by crying how young she was .Does anyone seriously believe she entered into this arrangement without any previous experience of pay for play , or even more unlikely , actually a virgin .She wasn't a child doing it unknowingly, no one was forcing her, you can see she was quite happy at the time from that photo with the Prince, does she look distressed or look like she was being forced to smile for the camera, no its obvious this wasn't her first time selling her body, maybe to royalty yes .
What about her parent's where did they think she was off to with her overnight bag and new clothes, going to the airport to meet her latest customer and going on his private plane to his private Island , bet they asked how much you getting first .The whole thing has turned from an innocent pay for play between two consenting adults , under British law., to a scheme to extract maximum pay back when they found out it's massive potential from money grabbers . I don't feel sorry for either party it's a possible price you have to endure if you choose the wrong one to play with .My only feeling goes out to my elderly Queen who after years of exemplary service to our nation has to endure the fall out from 20years ago of one of her kids stupidity .

[Niggly]

She wasn't a child doing it unknowingly, no one was forcing her,

Isn’t that the point though, she’s claiming to be a victim of child trafficking by Epstein & Maxwell & was forced. Having rumpy pumpy with an older man isn’t coming into it, it’s the trafficking that’s the issue.

The complaint says Giuffre “was compelled by express or implied threats” by Epstein & Maxwell to engage in sexual acts with Andrew, fearing repercussions for disobedience “due to their powerful connections, wealth, and authority”.

She claims she was forced into pay for play for at least 18 months before the HRH encounter & allegedly got $15000 USD for her time in London & similar in Manhattan & the Virgin Isles.

The Maxwell trial is Federal & more proof is likely to emerge so HRH lawyers might try to settle this Civil case early.

Oh, & I’ve no idea where her parents were.

[jackspratt]

The whole thing has turned from an innocent pay for play between two consenting adults , under British law.,

You had better update your understanding of British law, particularly as it applied to prostitution with someone under 18, and trafficking.

And then turn your mind to the law in New York, where this law suit is happening.

What her parents did or did not know, or encouraged, discouraged, or turned a blind eye to, is a deflection.

Should we similarly speculate about what the Lizzy and Phil knew about Randy Andy's predilections?

[GT93]

A bit of back ground on Epstein from Wiki:

In 2005, police in Palm Beach, Florida, began investigating Epstein after a parent complained that he had sexually abused her 14-year-old daughter.[8] Epstein pleaded guilty and was convicted in 2008 by a Florida state court of procuring a child for prostitution and of soliciting a prostitute.[5][9] He served almost 13 months in custody, but with extensive work release. He was convicted of only these two crimes as part of a controversial plea deal; federal officials had identified 36 girls, some as young as 14 years old, whom Epstein had allegedly sexually abused.[1][10]

Epstein was arrested again on July 6, 2019, on federal charges for the sex trafficking of minors in Florida and New York.[11][12] He died in his jail cell on August 10, 2019.[13] The medical examiner ruled the death a suicide.[14]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffrey_Epstein

Prince Andrew continued to hang out with someone who didn't give a damn about the welfare of kids and young women. I find it easy to believe Epstein was coercing women and even girls to go with the idiot Prince.

[Drunk Monkey]

She wasn't a child doing it unknowingly, no one was forcing her,

Isn’t that the point though, she’s claiming to be a victim of child trafficking by Epstein & Maxwell & was forced. Having rumpy pumpy with an older man isn’t coming into it, it’s the trafficking that’s the issue.

The complaint says Giuffre “was compelled by express or implied threats” by Epstein & Maxwell to engage in sexual acts with Andrew, fearing repercussions for disobedience “due to their powerful connections, wealth, and authority”.

She claims she was forced into pay for play for at least 18 months before the HRH encounter & allegedly got $15000 USD for her time in London & similar in Manhattan & the Virgin Isles.

The Maxwell trial is Federal & more proof is likely to emerge so HRH lawyers might try to settle this Civil case early.

Oh, & I’ve no idea where her parents were.

I may have missed something but if all this was so traumatic for Ms Guiffre why did she attend on multiple accasions and locations n not refuse ?? ... as quite a youngster one has to question her parents role in allowing ger to be put in a position to get involved in the first place ..then again re attend .

Dm

[Niggly]

I may have missed something but if all this was so traumatic for Ms Guiffre why did she attend on multiple accasions and locations n not refuse ?? ... as quite a youngster one has to question her parents role in allowing ger to be put in a position to get involved in the first place ..then again re attend .

Dm

She was a minor & alleging she was one of many held against her will & forced by rich & powerful people. The same people who have been brought up on federal charges for child trafficking so there must be some truth in it. Epstein cashed in his chips rather than face the music so there’s no smoke without fire. Maxwells upcoming trial should unearth a few more skeletons.
I have still no idea where her parents come into the equation other than her dad was a maintenance man paid a pittance at the spa where she was a trainee masseuse & was first taken with the promise of bright lights & untold wealth.
If they were paid off it still doesn’t make it right.

I don’t know or really care about HRHs involvement. It’s the lies he’s been found out about which aren’t doing him any favours. I mean, if you’ve absolutely nothing to hide, why lie?

[GT93]

Hanging out with Epstein after Epstein had served some time for wicked activities was friggin' stupid. It can, of course, be painted much worse than "stupid".

[GT93]

Prince Andrew has been looking a bit iffy again ...

[GT93]

Of course, it's quite possible that Queen Elizabeth's favourite son learnt a few tricks from Epstein. There might be a couple of young stunners, tens, on the favourite son's domestic staff earning indecent money. That would be very risky but the favourite son isn't famous for his intelligence.