Biden Fist Bumps with Saudi Crown Prince

[Laan Yaa Mo]

Hopefully people do care about Khashoggi, or what he represents at least.

A socially and politically backward kingdom decides it is OK to send an assassination team to a 3rd country, to carve up (literally) a mild critic, inside their own consulate building.

I recognise the realpolitik (ie oil, and Iran), but that doesn't make a dictatorish ***** like MBS right, or that his actions (and not just this) should be glossed over.

Agree with you wholeheartedly. It matters.

[Mosquito]

It matters, but (always a but)....

Picking the worst of two evils.

Putin's three biggest leverages are oil, natural gas and having nukes

If bearing with MBS weakens one of Putin's cards (oil)...............then ---- I'd be ok with Biden fist pumping and kissing MBS's cheeks (face cheeks, not the cheeks most of you are thinking of).

If you're looking at global threats, climate change / global warming and Putin's unchecked aggression are the biggest threats (IMO).

[Khun Paul]

Agree with the last two posts regarding threats to the WORLDS HUMAN population . Any conflagration is bad , the current one is dangerous for the whole of Europe ( which includes eastern Europe especially.
Using Energy resources as a Political tool is mind-numbingly stupid.
There are far greater dangers not least the economies of many teetering following the Pandemic and the sheer it would seem inability to travel from A to B, easily for many.
Many countries will see insularity as a way forward to secure not only their borders , dividing not only trade but movement of people in an attempt to protect their citizens.
What we enjoyed PRE-PANDEMIC is going sadly .

[tamada]

Islamic extremism may have gone off the radar with the quelling of Isis/Daesh and Russian support for Syria's despot but the Israeli-Palestinian conflict and the willingness to foment that conflict by Iran and certain disparate Muslim sects only needs a spark to be reignited. There's also a hot vacuum in Afghanistan again and proxy wars like the one in Yemen will persist. I also still see the Balkans as a tinderbox in the heart of Europe.

Sun Tzu said, "Keep your friends close; keep your enemies closer."

[Whistler]

Not Sun Tzu in 'Art of war'. Niccolò Machiavelli in 'The Prince'

Often attributed to Sun Tzu, but I think that is mistaken as it came from an earlier translation of Machiavelli well before Tzu's fantastic book reached the English speaking world.

https://www.southernstandard.com/opinio ... es-closer/

[tamada]

Agree with the last two posts regarding threats to the WORLDS HUMAN population . Any conflagration is bad , the current one is dangerous for the whole of Europe ( which includes eastern Europe especially.
Using Energy resources as a Political tool is mind-numbingly stupid.
There are far greater dangers not least the economies of many teetering following the Pandemic and the sheer it would seem inability to travel from A to B, easily for many.
Many countries will see insularity as a way forward to secure not only their borders , dividing not only trade but movement of people in an attempt to protect their citizens.
What we enjoyed PRE-PANDEMIC is going sadly .

As for "Using Energy resources as a Political tool", this predates Putin's misadventures by several decades. Although it was the ostensibly apolitical OPEC that precipitated the global fuel crisis in 1973, it was at that time mostly an Arab cartel so there is the flawed politics of Pan-Arab 'nationalism' to consider. The 1990 Oil Crisis was triggered by the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait; another border squabble gone badly wrong. Although both these events may have been apolitical or militarist at the outset, their consequences quickly became political tools for some non-Arab parties who were impacted by the blowback.

As some pundits have pointed out, the conflicts in the mid-east, being in another continent, tended to insulate the US, Europe and 'the west' from the feeling of being directly threatened. The rumble in Ukraine has severely jolted this western insularity. Now their energy security AND independence is under the Kremlin's military cosh.

I recall seeing a YouTube that shows each and every POTUS since Eisenhower mentioning the need to seek "energy independence" in their inaugural addresses. That's from both the Dems and the Reps so it can't be a simple 'copy/paste' error from the script writers.

[papafarang]

If the Sanctions on Russian oil was lifted wouldn't logic say the price of oil and gas would drop dramatically. Therefore reducing the amount of money Russia could make out of its resorses . and how about opening up nord 2 so that people could heat their homes this winter. The idea of using energy as a political weapon is as they say shooting yourself in the foot

[Mosquito]

If the Sanctions on Russian oil was lifted wouldn't logic say the price of oil and gas would drop dramatically. Therefore reducing the amount of money Russia could make out of its resorses . and how about opening up nord 2 so that people could heat their homes this winter. The idea of using energy as a political weapon is as they say shooting yourself in the foot

Welcome to the reality, humans have always used resources as political tools/weapons.

Oil sales account for 40-45% of Russia's GDP, and according to reports Russia oil revenue has actually increased over the past 5 months mainly due to increased oil prices (even with Russia selling oil at a 15-20% discount compared with international market prices).

If the US can get India, China, UAE and Saudi to stop buying Russian oil (only in a perfect world would that happen)......Putin is screwed. Of the four only see the UAE and Saudi as long shot possibilities.

Then there's Germany, Italy, and the Netherlands getting them to reduce current Russian oil purchases would greatly help. Also, lowering oil prices has to be hurting Putin's war chest.

Basically, if paying more at the pump, more for my monthly electricity bill and more for this winter heating (not really a thing here in Thailand, but hopefully you get my point) it would be worth the price to get Putin outta office.
Why?? IMO, Putin is Hitler's 21st Century Clone.

[Laan Yaa Mo]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

[Aardvark]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

I think he's exterminating Ukrainian Citizens'...

[Mosquito]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

1. Invasion of a Peaceful Nation.
2. Arrest or Assassination of Political Rivals.
3. Violation of International Law, Treaties and Agreements.
4. War Crimes.
5. Persecution of Minority Groups.
6. Persecution / Elimination of Free Press.

Oh, you must be using "long shot" mainly taking into account the body count (assumption on my part).
WW2 estimated body count 40-50 million over close to 6 years, Ukraine invasion is only 6 months old.

Doubt body count will come close to WW2 numbers, but there is a shot that Putin might toss a few nucs here and there and that 40-50 million WW2 number might be smashed.

So, 6 months into the Ukraine invasion body count number estimates range from as little as 30k to over 100k. That doesn't take into account the deaths caused by the ripple effects of the invasion....and the potential millions that'll die outside the conflict should this war drag out for a few years.

[tamada]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

I think he's exterminating Ukrainian Citizens'...

His armed forces and militias are killing Ukrainian armed forces and civilians. The early claims of genocide are unfounded and although it's brutal, there's no policy of extermination.

[papafarang]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

1. Invasion of a Peaceful Nation.
2. Arrest or Assassination of Political Rivals.
3. Violation of International Law, Treaties and Agreements.
4. War Crimes.
5. Persecution of Minority Groups.
6. Persecution / Elimination of Free Press.

Oh, you must be using "long shot" mainly taking into account the body count (assumption on my part).
WW2 estimated body count 40-50 million over close to 6 years, Ukraine invasion is only 6 months old.

Doubt body count will come close to WW2 numbers, but there is a shot that Putin might toss a few nucs here and there and that 40-50 million WW2 number might be smashed.

So, 6 months into the Ukraine invasion body count number estimates range from as little as 30k to over 100k. That doesn't take into account the deaths caused by the ripple effects of the invasion....and the potential millions that'll die outside the conflict should this war drag out for a few years.

You do know Ukraine has arrested lots of .political opposition and banned 11 other political parties. Taken control of all TV stations , specific laws against the Russian language that don't apply to any other languages. Can you imagine the uproar if the UK made specific laws against speaking Arabic ? Or banned teaching of the Jewish language in the UK private schools or even demanded that all minorities must use English as their first language. You have to look at facts , not what Russia says or the BBC says.

[tamada]

Not by a long shot since Putin has yet to target a group to exterminate along with death camps to house the perceived menace to society.

1. Invasion of a Peaceful Nation.
2. Arrest or Assassination of Political Rivals.
3. Violation of International Law, Treaties and Agreements.
4. War Crimes.
5. Persecution of Minority Groups.
6. Persecution / Elimination of Free Press.

Oh, you must be using "long shot" mainly taking into account the body count (assumption on my part).
WW2 estimated body count 40-50 million over close to 6 years, Ukraine invasion is only 6 months old.

Doubt body count will come close to WW2 numbers, but there is a shot that Putin might toss a few nucs here and there and that 40-50 million WW2 number might be smashed.

So, 6 months into the Ukraine invasion body count number estimates range from as little as 30k to over 100k. That doesn't take into account the deaths caused by the ripple effects of the invasion....and the potential millions that'll die outside the conflict should this war drag out for a few years.

Zelenskyy's big challenge is to keep the allies focused on the war and the constant need for materiel. As northern Europe passes through Autumn into Winter, the allies focus will increasingly be on gas supplies and keeping raging inflation in check against constantly rising energy prices. With his best cheerleader having just been ousted, he'll be feeling a bit lonely.

[jackspratt]

You do know Ukraine has arrested lots of .political opposition and banned 11 other political parties. Taken control of all TV stations , specific laws against the Russian language that don't apply to any other languages. Can you imagine the uproar if the UK made specific laws against speaking Arabic ? Or banned teaching of the Jewish language in the UK private schools or even demanded that all minorities must use English as their first language. You have to look at facts , not what Russia says or the BBC says.

Given that the Ukraine is in a full fledged battle for its very existence, and under martial law, the things you mention don't surprise me.

[Mosquito]

You do know Ukraine has arrested lots of .political opposition and banned 11 other political parties. Taken control of all TV stations , specific laws against the Russian language that don't apply to any other languages. Can you imagine the uproar if the UK made specific laws against speaking Arabic ? Or banned teaching of the Jewish language in the UK private schools or even demanded that all minorities must use English as their first language. You have to look at facts , not what Russia says or the BBC says.

Given that the Ukraine is in a full fledged battle for its very existence, and under martial law, the things you mention don't surprise me.

papafarang you need to start looking at facts and reality, along with not posting misleading information.

Though true, you completely miss represent the reasoning behind such actions.................ie being fricking invaded by Russia.

https://apnews.com/article/europe-ukrai ... 276482477c

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... -to-russia

[deankham]

.....
Oil sales account for 40-45% of Russia's GDP, and according to reports Russia oil revenue has actually increased over the past 5 months mainly due to increased oil prices (even with Russia selling oil at a 15-20% discount compared with international market prices).

If the US can get India, China, UAE and Saudi to stop buying Russian oil (only in a perfect world would that happen)......Putin is screwed. Of the four only see the UAE and Saudi as long shot possibilities.
.....

I was going to suggest you were wrong about Saudi buying Russian Oil (as they are a massive oil producer) but seems I was totally wrong! Good info Mosquito.

Saudi Arabia has for several years imported Russian fuel oil, which can reduce its need to refine crude for products and cut the amount of oil it needs to burn for power, leaving it with more unrefined crude to sell on international markets at higher prices

[papafarang]

You do know Ukraine has arrested lots of .political opposition and banned 11 other political parties. Taken control of all TV stations , specific laws against the Russian language that don't apply to any other languages. Can you imagine the uproar if the UK made specific laws against speaking Arabic ? Or banned teaching of the Jewish language in the UK private schools or even demanded that all minorities must use English as their first language. You have to look at facts , not what Russia says or the BBC says.

Given that the Ukraine is in a full fledged battle for its very existence, and under martial law, the things you mention don't surprise me.

papafarang you need to start looking at facts and reality, along with not posting misleading information.

Though true, you completely miss represent the reasoning behind such actions.................ie being fricking invaded by Russia.

https://apnews.com/article/europe-ukrai ... 276482477c

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... -to-russia

Though true ? I've not miss represented anything . these are just facts. Ukrainian's don't like Russians, Ukraine wants to eradicate Russian culture . so let's look back to the start , Crimea. First off Crimea was basically given to Ukraine..by the commies in 1954 . good old commies eh. Although it became part of Ukraine it was autonomous due to being largely a Russian population . Crimea did by the way try to be independent in 1990 as the Soviets collapsed, but Ukraine just gave them autonomy . well anyway Crimea is back to being part of Russia. So back to reality. I don't look up newspapers , I prefer information rather than opinion or someone else's analysis. Remember 99% of what is on the internet is BS, marketing, lies and propaganda, sometimes all of the above

[Mosquito]

You do know Ukraine has arrested lots of .political opposition and banned 11 other political parties. Taken control of all TV stations , specific laws against the Russian language that don't apply to any other languages. Can you imagine the uproar if the UK made specific laws against speaking Arabic ? Or banned teaching of the Jewish language in the UK private schools or even demanded that all minorities must use English as their first language. You have to look at facts , not what Russia says or the BBC says.

Given that the Ukraine is in a full fledged battle for its very existence, and under martial law, the things you mention don't surprise me.

papafarang you need to start looking at facts and reality, along with not posting misleading information.

Though true, you completely miss represent the reasoning behind such actions.................ie being fricking invaded by Russia.

https://apnews.com/article/europe-ukrai ... 276482477c

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/ ... -to-russia

Though true ? I've not miss represented anything . these are just facts. Ukrainian's don't like Russians, Ukraine wants to eradicate Russian culture . so let's look back to the start , Crimea. First off Crimea was basically given to Ukraine..by the commies in 1954 . good old commies eh. Although it became part of Ukraine it was autonomous due to being largely a Russian population . Crimea did by the way try to be independent in 1990 as the Soviets collapsed, but Ukraine just gave them autonomy . well anyway Crimea is back to being part of Russia. So back to reality. I don't look up newspapers , I prefer information rather than opinion or someone else's analysis. Remember 99% of what is on the internet is BS, marketing, lies and propaganda, sometimes all of the above

Are you sure you're not getting your slightly twisted truths/facts info from Russian Troll Farms??

Nice dropping Crimea into the discussion. Let's see Crimea invaded and illegally annexed by Russia (will give that majority of Crimea's population are pro-Russian) in 2014. Russia used the same justification to invade Ukraine, as it did in Crimea.

I have a problem, who should I believe...Putin/Russian State Department or the UN General Assembly on the invasion of Crimea (2014) and the invasion of Ukraine (2022).
Putin / Russian State Department does have a point about ‘Denazification’ in Ukraine, Right??

I get your point, nothing is black and white and no state is completely innocent. However, Putin and Russia are clearly the most guilty/evil in this!!!!

[tamada]

Claiming Russian-speaking citizens in a foreign enclave are being threatened with violence aren't grounds for invading that foreign country. Giving those foreigners citizenship by way of a passport certainly changes the dynamic but doesn't make the invasion any more legitimate. However, Putin has used this justification before without any serious challenges ever being raised by the international community.

But this is way, WAY off topic.

Despite speaking a common language, Saudi hasn't been offering any Yemenis a second passport. However, they have been bombing them and killing them with British-made armaments. Different strokes, etc..