1550+ environmentalists arrested in a Dutch protest

[Laan Yaa Mo]

The police arrested over 1550 protesters in The Hague yesterday. The Dutch law enforcement officers moved in when the environmentalists refused to end their blockade of a highway. Of the total detained, all but 40 have been released. It seems there were about 6,000 protesters at the blockade in the Netherlands.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65735289

[stattointhailand]

How dare the people protest

"Protesting on this road is banned under rules brought in by the mayor."

must have been watching UK govt/Police dealing with coronation protesters ......... change the law then arrest them

By the look of the photos the Schutzstaffel armbands havent arrived there yet

[Doodoo]

https://www.barrons.com/news/over-1-500 ... s-b1139264

Only 40 will be prosecuted and SOME on Vandalism
One office was bitten

This isnt even News worthy. The protestors should be ashamed

[jackspratt]

Ashamed for what?

[stattointhailand]

Ashamed of not being trodden all over by those who only care about themselves

[tamada]

How dare the people protest

"Protesting on this road is banned under rules brought in by the mayor."

must have been watching UK govt/Police dealing with coronation protesters ......... change the law then arrest them

By the look of the photos the Schutzstaffel armbands havent arrived there yet

Good grief, just listen to yourself. The right to peaceful protest has been disabused by these climate and civilization freaks. Lock 'em all up.

Yours,
Proud fossil fuel realist.
Auchtermuchty

[tamada]

Ashamed of not being trodden all over by those who only care about themselves

How much do you top up at the petrol station? Hah loy? Nung pahn? More?

[tamada]

https://www.barrons.com/news/over-1-500 ... s-b1139264

Only 40 will be prosecuted and SOME on Vandalism
One office was bitten

This isnt even News worthy. The protestors should be ashamed

Agreed. They should be sent off to the Philippines to pick up the hugely disproportionate amount of plastic waste that's generated there. You know, real work experience.

[jackspratt]

Good grief, just listen to yourself. The right to peaceful protest has been disabused by these climate and civilization freaks. Lock 'em all up.

Yours,
Proud fossil fuel realist.
Auchtermuchty

If they were disabused, why would they be protesting?

Is your realism closely aligned to your income source(s)?

[pipoz4444]

The police arrested over 1550 protesters in The Hague yesterday. The Dutch law enforcement officers moved in when the environmentalists refused to end their blockade of a highway. Of the total detained, all but 40 have been released. It seems there were about 6,000 protesters at the blockade in the Netherlands.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65735289

I just wonder how many of these Protestors have benefited during their lifetime from the proceeds of the Oil and Gas industry in the Netherlands, given the Netherlands is an oil producing, trading and importing nation and has been for many years, not to mention that much of the Dutch electricity system is produced from the use fossil fuels for power generation, mainly from natural gas and coal. I can only assume that many of these 6,000 protestors are Dutch citizens, given the protest was in THE HAGUE.

These hypocrites have been living happily in the Netherlands, off the back Oil and Gas industry for many years, happily the driving their cars, turning their lights on at home every night, cooking their hot meals, watching their TVs’. Some I would suggest have probably worked in the O & G industry or Power sector, if not directly related to and or depended on Oil and Gas and Energy sectors, for part of their lives. The age of several protestors suggests maybe even for longer.

But only now, do they say it is all wrong or should be stopped, after having derived much of their modern-day lifestyle from it?

If they don't like the benefits derived from O & Gas Energy sector, then why don't they ride a bicycle, live at home in the dark, eat cold salads for their evening meal, give up their jobs and F.. k off to another country.

Also it is only recent that the Dutch Pension Fund PFZW sold off some USD 325 Million worth of Investments in Fossil Fuels. Prior to that they built a large part of that Funds Wealth base from the profits derived from those Fossil Fuel Investments, over the past 50 years. Tell me if that is not true and tell me the Fund made all its money from Solar Power?

So, I suggest that these Protestors, who consider the O & G Industry and Energy Sector so offensive and tainted, try giving up Pension incomes as well, if they truly believe it is so offensive. No, I don’t see that happening either.

These same people will happily collect their Pensions, just like many others, even some on this Forum, turning a blind eye to where the Wealth of the Pension Fund came from, enjoying their lifestyle gains from an Industry or Sector that they proclaim to despise or detest.

Again, just Hypocrites in raincoats.

Happy to take the benefits from it and even more happy to proclaim they don’t need it?


Just look at how much Oil the Netherlands produces days and how much it actually imports and needs, to keep the lights on and maintain their lifestyles?? and in 2021 it bought 42 % of its Oil IMPORTS from RUSSIA. Well I am shocked.

Pipoz4444

[tamada]

Good grief, just listen to yourself. The right to peaceful protest has been disabused by these climate and civilization freaks. Lock 'em all up.

Yours,
Proud fossil fuel realist.
Auchtermuchty

If they were disabused, why would they be protesting?

Is your realism closely aligned to your income source(s)?

A wee bit maybe but probably more aligned to the light company, Big C and the airlines.

Since you ask, who's floating your boat these days? You know, keeping your boat from sinking?

[stattointhailand]

Pipoz, are these Hypocrites in Nederlands not allowed to change their opinion when provided with different evidence?
When I came to Thailand I would estimate 95% of farangs here were smokers. That has reduced to a much smaller number now as we have all been educated. Just because something was acceptable 20 yrs ago does not make it so today

[jackspratt]

Whew, I see a great big red herring (excuse the pun) has entered the debate.

Given that no one knows what the pension status of the various protesters were, and that many of them looked quite young anyway, there is no hypocrisy demonstrated (excuse this one also).

[pipoz4444]

Hmmm Jack, then let me ask you, where does you place in Thailand get its Power from, every day and every night. Let me guess, in all probability from Fossil Fuels, just like about 75-80% plus of the World's population, who rely on it for their energy source, everyday.

If you were honest with yourself, you would acknowledge that you and the majority of the worlds population actually need and depend on the Fossil Fuels Industries and Sectors which feed off it, just for your everyday life style. Is that not the case?

You have needed the benefits from the use of Fossil Fuels for the past 70 plus years (more like 150), you need them for Today and and you will still need it for the distant foreseeable future, just like those 6,000 protestors.

No red herring here, just a fact.

So, yes, I see plenty of hypocrisy in those that only see fit to criticize the Fossil Fuel industries/sectors for what they say it has done and not for what it actually does do. Those that are happy to reap the benefits of it, yet advocate against it.

I for one am more than happy and proud to admit that I earn my living (not a pension) of the back off the Fossil Fuel Industry in a Sector, in an Oil & Gas rich Country, in a Region, where the production of Fossil Fuels employs and directly and or indirectly supports the livelihood of some 300 Million people, if not more.

These are people, many of whom are considered poor by most standards, people had no real work opportunities in their home countries (such as India, Banglaldesh etc) a vast majority because of their lack of proper education and yet they have found opportunities to work in the region and through that work in the Fossil Fuel industry and or in the spin offs, now earn a living and are now able to support their families abroad.

And Protestors with their idealistic outlook want to take that opportunity away from them?

So Jack one final question - Are you for the Fossil Fuel industry or are you against it or do you sit on the Fence too afraid to voice the truth.

pipoz4444

[stattointhailand]

The fact that something has been relied upon and been the way things are done for years does not make it automatically acceptable to continue for many more years if it is found to be wrong.
Those who could vote back in the day considered owning slaves to be a good thing that needed to continue to avoid everyday life collapsing, until enough people stood up and protested against it.
Thats what peaceful protests are for ....... making people aware that the way we do something is NOT the only way, and that there are alternatives available.

[tamada]

There was an alternative to slavery, always was an alternative to slavery. It still took several decades before everyone got onboard with it.

So far, pretty much all the alternatives being popularly touted by these soup, paint and powder tossers, are either not sustainable, have their own onerous 'carbon footprint' or cannot be integrated with existing infrastructure as magically as those that glue themselves to public thoroughfares think.

[jackspratt]

You seem to be confused, pipo, not to mention condescending.

My posts on this thread have consistently been about the protesters, and their right to protest. They appear to have a particular view on the negative effects of the fossil fuel industry on the world's climate, and the impact that is having right now, and even more so into the future, ie when you and I won't be around to worry about it.

I am a bit more pragmatic, and recognise that fossil fuels will be required in the short term, but hopefully on a quickly diminishing scale. And recognising that gas is the lesser of 2 evils, I would hope that oil exploration is wound down pretty quickly.

[tamada]

You seem to be confused, pipo, not to mention condescending.

My posts on this thread have consistently been about the protesters, and their right to protest. They appear to have a particular view on the negative effects of the fossil fuel industry on the world's climate, and the impact that is having right now, and even more so into the future, ie when you and I won't be around to worry about it.

I am a bit more pragmatic, and recognise that fossil fuels will be required in the short term, but hopefully on a quickly diminishing scale. And recognising that gas is the lesser of 2 evils, I would hope that oil exploration is wound down pretty quickly.

Protest is beneficial but it should never, ever cause disruption to the lives of others. If you don't have a dog in the fight, why should you be forced to watch or even attend the dog fight? In the same way as train drivers shouldn't have the legal right to effectively stop people going to work or make people spend more getting to their work, those with environmental hyper-sensitivity shouldn't be slow-walking busy city streets and gluing themselves to motorways and discomfiting their fellow oxygen wasters more than they already are.

OK, we all live and (hopefully) breath in the currently overheated global ecosystem so yes, we probably do have a dog after all but maybe the problem is a wildly differing perception of what constitutes a "short term"?

I've got 3 years validity remaining on my mandatory 'evil' industry certifications. They can do what they want after that but until then, I am doing my best to discover as much gas as possible outwith the hallowed pages of this forum.

[Whistler]

No matter how strident the arguments are on here and elsewhere, the world is under transition and will move away from fossil fuels eventually.

Coal is the easiest to deal with for energy production, it is cheaper to build a solar or wind farm than to build a coal power station of similar output, storage to provide base power has yet to be solved but the transition to clean electricity is maturing. Gas seems to be part of that transition, not greenhouse gas-free, it is at least less dirty than coal which is awful.

Oil is a different story, and protesting about oil subsidies and production is pretty futile until a viable solution is here, that looks a long way off. EV's will be part of the alternative, but it places more pressure on the electricty supply while that is undergoing changes, EV's are not helping by placing more burden on supply, the EV's are heavy and battery production has its own environmental challenges. My guess is that EV's will probably be less than 10% or 20% of ground vehicles (with the exception of trains). I am not against EV's at all, they suit certain conditions, but I don't think they are a silver bullet.

That means we have to find a viable fuel for the other 80 to 90 percent of cars and trucks, maybe green hydrogen, I guess that is the most promising alternative.

So tying this to the subject matter. People have a right to protest, but I do not see them winning hearts and minds by causing massive inconvenience to the community or defacing works of art or disrupting events that have no connection to fossil fuels. If they want to make a change, protest for more funding for research.

[Doodoo]

To put this in context, construction of a 500 MW power plant for the different energy sources would cost around:

$1.8 billion for a solar power plant
$1.5 billion for a typical coal plant
$2.6 billion for a coal plant with CCS
$482 million for a natural gas plant
As you can see, there’s not a huge difference between solar and the average coal plant (natural gas is another story though and, in fact, many new power plants are natural gas powered)

Who’s the winner?
Simply put, solar and renewable energy is the future. While admittedly we don’t have all the kinks worked out quite yet – solar panel efficiency could be pumped up a few percentages and batteries need to drop considerably in price – solar energy’s lack of emissions, continually falling prices, and free fuel source move it into the winning slot.