TAX on Income from Abroad

[pipoz4444]

My guess is it can only trace/track Bank to Bank transfers and then they will need to decide whether it is,

1.Income earnt from Overseas Work (Personal) being transferred back to Thailand
2.Income earnt from Overseas Assets (such as that from a Company) being transferred back to Thailand
3.Monetary Assets acquired Overseas now being transferred / moved to Thailand
4.Monthly Pension Allowances from other Governments being onforwarded to Thailand

Note: The Revenue Department has ruled that a person who resides in Thailand for up to 180 days a year and earnt overseas income from work or assets will be subject to personal income tax, according to Section 48 of the Revenue Code

The words above are "Earnt overseas income from Work or Assets...." There is no specific mention of Pension Allowances and Pensions allowances do not seem to fall into the wording/definition of "earnt overseas income from work or assets" . Therefore pensions may well be excluded in the final outcome, although that is subject to how the Revenue Department wishes to interpret their Rule/Law.


pipoz4444

[tamada]

Interesting use of the past participle there. I was reading another casual interpretation of these rules which suggests that it is primarily to close the tax loophole of Thailand's diaspora working overseas remitting these overseas earnings to Thailand untaxed. Whether the impoverished pensioner gets swept up in this money grab is debatable (3 pages and counting) but if anyone feels the need to discuss in person with some of Oodorn's finest foreign financial advisors, I thoroughly recommend dropping by Colin's Car Spa & Brews next Friday afternoon.

PS: It's not just a car wash.

[Khun Paul]

Oner could bounce this situation around until the cows come home and still not come up with a definitive answer. Suffice to say the reipicral agreement signed by Thailand with 69 nations holds firm on pensions and unearned income it seems, as long as it is either taxed in the foreigners home country. What will be the litmus test is how they are intending to progress the collection of monies not currently taxed. How are they intending to determine what moniues iof any a foreigner has to pay Tax on and how are they intending to issue a Income tax number to those foreigners who ARE NOT working here and only have an O Visa for long stay .
The why and hows are numerous and can be argued amongst the great and the good including the geriatric get togethers at a car wash of all places . But the nub of the problem is as usual the lack of clarity by the current Government , what has not been said will probably not hurt us expats in any way, however some whose finances are not exactly squeaky clean may be wondering their best course of action. To those I say good luck

[FrazeeDK]

and how would the revenue department even know what income you earn in your home country? Are they going to ask for documentation? Nah, this is all for naught until they hash out all the details... I can't see the Revenue Department asking people to bring all their documentation to the Revenue Office (located on the east side Ring Road in Udon) seeing as how they'd be in a variety of languages nobody in the office would likely understand...

[tamada]

Oner could bounce this situation around until the cows come home and still not come up with a definitive answer. Suffice to say the reipicral agreement signed by Thailand with 69 nations holds firm on pensions and unearned income it seems, as long as it is either taxed in the foreigners home country. What will be the litmus test is how they are intending to progress the collection of monies not currently taxed. How are they intending to determine what moniues iof any a foreigner has to pay Tax on and how are they intending to issue a Income tax number to those foreigners who ARE NOT working here and only have an O Visa for long stay .
The why and hows are numerous and can be argued amongst the great and the good including the geriatric get togethers at a car wash of all places . But the nub of the problem is as usual the lack of clarity by the current Government , what has not been said will probably not hurt us expats in any way, however some whose finances are not exactly squeaky clean may be wondering their best course of action. To those I say good luck

You would be amazed at the sagelike clarity that the seasoned veterans exude every Friday after maybe four or five large Changs.

Then again, you probably wouldn't be.

[tamada]

and how would the revenue department even know what income you earn in your home country? Are they going to ask for documentation? Nah, this is all for naught until they hash out all the details... I can't see the Revenue Department asking people to bring all their documentation to the Revenue Office (located on the east side Ring Road in Udon) seeing as how they'd be in a variety of languages nobody in the office would likely understand...

I thought the Revenue Office was down town near the other government offices? That's where I went earlier this year to get a Thai tax ID.

[FrazeeDK]

don't know which handles what but the office on the Ring Road is the Regional Treasury Office. https://www.google.com/maps/place/%E0%B ... ?entry=ttu

[jackspratt]

A while back my bank in Australia insisted I send them evidence that I was registered with the Thai Tax mob.

I had to go to the Revenue Office as per tamada's post above.

[tamada]

A while back my bank in Australia insisted I send them evidence that I was registered with the Thai Tax mob.

I had to go to the Revenue Office as per tamada's post above.

How did you get on there? Any success? I went from no clue, to no problem, to why, to you don't need, to can but ended up with a dispiriting cannot. This after about 45 minutes of being shuffled upstairs, downstairs across the hall, to the other building, etc.. One of the "obstacles" from the big boss lady was not being permitted to take the application form home, complete it and bring it back. Had to be done there she insisted. However, the girl in the other building had already given me two copies in case I buggered one up. It's all in Thai (why would it not be?) with loads of boxes to put information in, presumably Thai answers provided by Mrs tam would work best but I was denied finding out.

The only success was the parking guy letting me park right outside the door.

[jackspratt]

I ended up with a printout of what looks like Form 10.1.

It was nearly 3 years ago, so I am a bit hazy on the process.

Details are basically taken from my yellow book, and the Taxpayer Number is the same as my yellow book ID.

I assumed it was what I was asking for - anyway, my bank accepted it, which was the only real purpose for it.

[Brian Davis]

A friend of mine has pointed out this FAQ and answer still appearing on the Thai Embassy website. I appreciate that nothing is clear at present, but can I presume this would have to be negated by this new tax legislation if it did end up affecting pensioners? Whilst I’ve suggested to my pal to ‘hold his horses’, he’s investigating changing his permission to stay to being based on retirement from marriage!

https://www.thaiembassy.com/faq/do-reti ... income-tax?

[jackspratt]

Bear in mind the Thai Embassy website is not an official Thai government website - it is from a Thailand based legal firm.

[Brian Davis]

Thanks for pointing that out. Perhaps I'm being naive, but I would have expected that an agency allowed to operate under that name, would have accurate, updated information.

[Doodoo]

"More details on Thai taxation of overseas income"

https://aseannow.com/topic/1308279-more ... as-income/

[Khun Paul]

"More details on Thai taxation of overseas income"

https://aseannow.com/topic/1308279-more ... as-income/

Yes read that, now it is as clear as mud, leaves more questions unanswered than answered, some of their comments are flawed. I think wait and see is the best way forward, no point in getting in a tizzy about something that at best is a mix and match of various ideads, cobbled together in one paper, badly translated and poorly executed.

[tamada]

Just got an email from my IoM bank asking me to verify my Thailand TIN.

Coincidence?

[pipoz4444]

Another Article on the Subject. The Law or Section 41, as it pertains to the Tax liability for a Thai Resident or a Foreigner (deemed to be a Resident for Tax purposes) has apparently been in place for quite some time, so it is not new. In some respects the Thai Government is no different to other Governments around the world, all of who are trying to claw in as much tax from their "Residents", regardless of where the income is earned. Everyone wants a piece of the Salary/Income pie.

AUS: As an Australian Resident, you must declare any foreign income you earn on your Australian tax return. Income you need to declare and pay tax on if you are in Australia as a foreign or temporary resident. Employment income from certain types of international work may be exempt from Australian tax - There lies another question of how the Australian Government defines a persons as a Resident for Tax Purpose.

NZ: If you're a New Zealand tax resident, you need to pay tax in New Zealand on your worldwide income, even if you did not bring the money into this country. Common examples of overseas income are: interest you earn from overseas bank accounts. interest you earn from money invested overseas

THAILAND Article: On 15 September 2023, the Revenue Department of Thailand issued an instruction as guidance for revenue officers with regards to foreign-sourced income brought into Thailand by a Thai tax resident.

The Departmental Instruction No. Paw 161/2023 states that, effective from 1 January 2024, the foreign-sourced income derived by a Thai tax resident will be subject to Thai personal income tax when such income is brought into Thailand, regardless of where and when the foreign-sourced income is earned.

If enacted and upon it becoming effective, this will affect the tax liability of a Thai Tax Resident, who earned and brought a foreign-sourced income into Thailand, from the current interpretation of Section 41 of the Thai Revenue Code.

CURRENT INTERPRETATION OF SECTION 41 OF THE THAI REVENUE CODE:
An individual, whether Thai or foreigner, who resides in Thailand at one or more times for an aggregate period of 180 days or more in any tax (calendar) year will be deemed as a resident of Thailand for Thai income tax purposes (“Thai Tax Resident”) and thus subject to personal income tax (“PIT”) on income derived from sources outside Thailand. Income from sources outside Thailand includes income from employment, a post or office held outside Thailand, income from a business carried outside Thailand, income from a property situated outside Thailand (“Foreign-Sourced Income”).

https://www.wfw.com/articles/recent-dev ... d%2Fearned.

[deankham]

Time to bring all your money into thailand now and hide it under the bed......it's tax free if they don't know you have it

[rick]

Going by the Asean link, will not have any income as I only use a UK credit.card. Have not done a UK bank to Thai bank transfer in about 10 years.....

[tamada]

Going by the Asean link, will not have any income as I only use a UK credit.card. Have not done a UK bank to Thai bank transfer in about 10 years.....

Many foreigners will accept the 220 baht, foreign bank ATM transaction 'tax' as an acceptable alternative to paying either tax at source or tax in Thailand.

I recall about 25 years ago while working in Brazil when a central bank edict restricted the use of non-Brazilian plastic to a limited number of ATM in selective locations.

I understand that the ATM in Cambodia dispense only USD. Maybe a monthly "border hop" will become standard routine for tax dodgers here.