I had a friend a few years back that was an American citizen staying here on a tourist visa. He managed to get an annual visa for Lao. he lived in Nong Kia and had family in Lao. The visa allowed him to cross without the $30.00 each time. He also could drive his Thai registerd vehicle across.
Anybody got any ideas how he was able to pull this one off.
I would ask him but he was extremly uncoperative in this as he got himself shot to death in Nong Kia about a year ago.
The one thing that I really enjoyed in Lao on my few visits is that they have dance clubs there that are just like the states and you can dance on the a dance floor instead of standing by a table.
Might be fun to run over and have a bit of fun once in awhile if it isn't to much of hazzle. At the moment it seems like a pain to me, processing through each tiem spending $30.00 to spend money there and no transporation.
I have also heard nasty rumors that the Lao government willl give you land if you improve it using Lao labor. Now that one seems a little far fetched, but who knows. I wonder if you can own land there.
If you could travel there with out to many problems I'm told that once your away from Vientene, you can see what Issan was like thirty years ago.
I know guys have taken bike trips there just not sure how they went about it. I have seen some photos of some very beautiful country.
Anyway any thouhgts would be great to hear.
Laos just dreaming and scheming
About 4 years ago I was told about the securing of land by an official of the Gov't. Don't have his name so will only tell you what he told me at the time.
You can only rent the land from the Gov't. It will be for 99 years renewable. you also have to improve it and live on it. Tried to get wife to bite on this but got nowhere.
Ray this should ring a bell, do you remember the Spanish land grants? You know of individual Ranch? This is very much the same. As an ex-Policeman you would have to enforce your own security I think as don't think you would get much from the Govt. An interesting thought though "Ray's Ranch".
You can only rent the land from the Gov't. It will be for 99 years renewable. you also have to improve it and live on it. Tried to get wife to bite on this but got nowhere.
Ray this should ring a bell, do you remember the Spanish land grants? You know of individual Ranch? This is very much the same. As an ex-Policeman you would have to enforce your own security I think as don't think you would get much from the Govt. An interesting thought though "Ray's Ranch".
Me Casa Su Casa.banpaeng wrote:About 4 years ago I was told about the securing of land by an official of the Gov't. Don't have his name so will only tell you what he told me at the time.
You can only rent the land from the Gov't. It will be for 99 years renewable. you also have to improve it and live on it. Tried to get wife to bite on this but got nowhere.
Ray this should ring a bell, do you remember the Spanish land grants? You know of individual Ranch? This is very much the same. As an ex-Policeman you would have to enforce your own security I think as don't think you would get much from the Govt. An interesting thought though "Ray's Ranch".
This does seem very similar to the story I was told, Ausie Dom ran across a Chinese guy who was talking about getting involved there on a long term investment growing a very expensive hard wood use to make furniture. I guess tha coud get you an annual visa 99 years would probably cover my needs very well.
The other thing that may or may not work into a advantge wife's mother was Lao and her father was Thai, maybe that could be worked into something, like I said dreaming and scheming.
Where did you find the guy to talk to him?
Ray met him at Xiangung (can't spell but plain of jars) and was a police officer of about Capt rank. He could speak very good english but really used wife for translation. Really did think about it but one thing you have to consider (and this is wifes main input) if you do good will the govt take it away from you as really you have no rights. It might be like the money issue in another thread, if you don't try it you got nothing but maybe the Dinars will grow.
As basically this is now a puppet of China, they do know how to take land back.
An interesting point that amused me was "who is really in charge in Laos"? in visiting the country no name could really be said. Visited with a couple from Canada (they own a bakery there and also got some info from them) Who is in charge is a big question. Is rule by comittee really a possible situation?
Know not a lot of help but if you can find the bakery owned by a canadian(if still there) and can make friends, he is a wealth of information. Wish I had kept name and contact info.
As basically this is now a puppet of China, they do know how to take land back.
An interesting point that amused me was "who is really in charge in Laos"? in visiting the country no name could really be said. Visited with a couple from Canada (they own a bakery there and also got some info from them) Who is in charge is a big question. Is rule by comittee really a possible situation?
Know not a lot of help but if you can find the bakery owned by a canadian(if still there) and can make friends, he is a wealth of information. Wish I had kept name and contact info.
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arjay
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I also like the discos with the dance floors which they have in Ventiane, though on occasions I have been trampled by other over-exuberant farangs! The music at the Mekhong Hotel disco is good too, a mix of western, thai and laos music.
I understand the roads are abyssmal once you get outside Ventiane.
Whilst I like to visit, I get worried by stories I hear and frustrated by the transportation limitations. When my Laos g/f applies for her visa to leave, (yes to leave Laos) the cost always seems to be different and going upwards.
I spoke to a Dutch guy, who lives there some of the time, in proximity to his g/f whom he wants to marry. They can't live together until they are legally married, or he will be visited by the police and fined 500 dollars each time - twice so far.. He said it can take over a year to get a licence to marry and there are uncertain costs, which we might call bribes.
Nobody ever knows the full story or requirements for anything. One person will tell you you need (a) and (b), but won't know about (c) and (d), which the next person up the chain knows about, and so it goes on. As usual money seems to be a pre-requisite for most things and of course if you don't know what's next, you don't yet know the final cost.
I too am cautiously keen to learn more about the country and what one can and can't do there. If someone does have first hand knowledge or experience.
I understand the roads are abyssmal once you get outside Ventiane.
Whilst I like to visit, I get worried by stories I hear and frustrated by the transportation limitations. When my Laos g/f applies for her visa to leave, (yes to leave Laos) the cost always seems to be different and going upwards.
I spoke to a Dutch guy, who lives there some of the time, in proximity to his g/f whom he wants to marry. They can't live together until they are legally married, or he will be visited by the police and fined 500 dollars each time - twice so far.. He said it can take over a year to get a licence to marry and there are uncertain costs, which we might call bribes.
Nobody ever knows the full story or requirements for anything. One person will tell you you need (a) and (b), but won't know about (c) and (d), which the next person up the chain knows about, and so it goes on. As usual money seems to be a pre-requisite for most things and of course if you don't know what's next, you don't yet know the final cost.
I too am cautiously keen to learn more about the country and what one can and can't do there. If someone does have first hand knowledge or experience.
The net is of little use that I can see so far, least amopunt f information of any place I have researched. I to hope something come out of this from guys personal experience. That alone may be enought to scratch the itch.arjay wrote:I also like the discos with the dance floors which they have in Ventiane, though on occasions I have been trampled by other over-exuberant farangs! The music at the Mekhong Hotel disco is good too, a mix of western, thai and laos music.
I understand the roads are abyssmal once you get outside Ventiane.
Whilst I like to visit, I get worried by stories I hear and frustrated by the transportation limitations. When my Laos g/f applies for her visa to leave, (yes to leave Laos) the cost always seems to be different and going upwards.
I spoke to a Dutch guy, who lives there some of the time, in proximity to his g/f whom he wants to marry. They can't live together until they are legally married, or he will be visited by the police and fined 500 dollars each time - twice so far.. He said it can take over a year to get a licence to marry and there are uncertain costs, which we might call bribes.
Nobody ever knows the full story or requirements for anything. One person will tell you you need (a) and (b), but won't know about (c) and (d), which the next person up the chain knows about, and so it goes on. As usual money seems to be a pre-requisite for most things and of course if you don't know what's next, you don't yet know the final cost.
I too am cautiously keen to learn more about the country and what one can and can't do there. If someone does have first hand knowledge or experience.
Good suggetion to go meet the Canadian and it might be a fun trip.
Link to Laotian newspaper on line that some might have missed:
http://www.vientianetimes.com/Headlines.html
http://www.vientianetimes.com/Headlines.html
I met a guy getting a multiple entry one year visa for Lao. I think he said it was $500 or $600 dollars a year and you really have to know someone who is a somebody in Government. Might technically be a business visa.
Lao is very beautiful. The mountains on the road to Luang Prabang are steep and the road does not seem the safest for biking.
Vang Veng is about 3 hours north of Vientiane. It is at the start of the mountains but still has valley floor. Fun to float down the river on a tube. Drink beer. Lots of places serving pizza, beer, and banana pancakes. (Will understand if you go.)
Ask me when I haven't been drinking a few and can give more info. All the talk of beer selling hours made me thirsty.
Lao is very beautiful. The mountains on the road to Luang Prabang are steep and the road does not seem the safest for biking.
Vang Veng is about 3 hours north of Vientiane. It is at the start of the mountains but still has valley floor. Fun to float down the river on a tube. Drink beer. Lots of places serving pizza, beer, and banana pancakes. (Will understand if you go.)
Ask me when I haven't been drinking a few and can give more info. All the talk of beer selling hours made me thirsty.
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businessman
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Been surfing the net for years trying to get info on Laos but not a lot to read.If i felt better i would travel all over but a friend who drives a minibus and takes Thai tourists over there says the roads are terrible.From the river crossing in Loei to the capital is something like 400 km of dirt track with not one foot of paved road.
I believe a lot of Chinese investors are in the North of the country.
I believe a lot of Chinese investors are in the North of the country.
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arjay
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I heard this on the grapevine when in Nong Khai yesterday, so I cannot vouch for its' accuracy, nor could I get any detail. But several farangs in Nk were aware of it.
Apparently, two farangs met or picked up 2 Laos girls in Pattaya and subsequently went back to Laos with them, where they partied at the family home and stayed overnight there with the girls.
The next morning the girls parents asked or told them you're going to my marry my daughter(s), to which the farangs said no. So the parents called the police, and the farangs were arrested and are now in jail and won't be let out until they have paid many thousands of dollars. The figure may have been 13k dollars, but I am really NOT SURE about that.
I don't know how long they have been there, or what nationality they are. And as my GF says, there may be more to it than appears, but it is a concern that people over there seem to have no rights or recourse. I just wonder if their embassy even knows!
Has anyone else heard anything about that? I may have to change my Xmas plans.
Apparently, two farangs met or picked up 2 Laos girls in Pattaya and subsequently went back to Laos with them, where they partied at the family home and stayed overnight there with the girls.
The next morning the girls parents asked or told them you're going to my marry my daughter(s), to which the farangs said no. So the parents called the police, and the farangs were arrested and are now in jail and won't be let out until they have paid many thousands of dollars. The figure may have been 13k dollars, but I am really NOT SURE about that.
I don't know how long they have been there, or what nationality they are. And as my GF says, there may be more to it than appears, but it is a concern that people over there seem to have no rights or recourse. I just wonder if their embassy even knows!
Has anyone else heard anything about that? I may have to change my Xmas plans.
Don't doubt that one a bit Pattaya and Lao are two different things completly.
One of the mebers of our VFW post lives in Lao, he is married but apparently the Lao goevenment didn't recognize he legality of the marriage he wa deported and banned for a long period of time.
Mind this, this is with a marriage, village style, as I recall the Police Chief iht thier local village married them seems it didn't have that power.
So what you described does not seem out of reality to me at all. Especialy with the family complaining
One of the mebers of our VFW post lives in Lao, he is married but apparently the Lao goevenment didn't recognize he legality of the marriage he wa deported and banned for a long period of time.
Mind this, this is with a marriage, village style, as I recall the Police Chief iht thier local village married them seems it didn't have that power.
So what you described does not seem out of reality to me at all. Especialy with the family complaining
Laos "Secret" law
The several references to sexual relations between unmarried Lao and foreigner is true.. The Lao government has an unpublished "Secret" law that states if you're caught you can be fined $500 to $5000. It seems to be selectively applied. Foreigners engaging service girls in Vientiane are rarely grabbed. Foriegners who accompany their girlfriends to their villages seem to excite the suspicion of villagers thus getting themselves arrested. The reference to the law is posted on the U.S. Embassy Vientiane website at: http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_t ... s_946.html which states:
RELATIONSHIPS WITH LAO CITIZENS: The Lao Government prohibits sexual contact between foreign citizens and Lao nationals except when the two parties have been married in accordance with Lao Family Law. Any foreigner who enters into a sexual relationship with a Lao national may be interrogated, detained, arrested, or jailed. Lao police have confiscated passports and imposed fines of up to $5000 on foreigners who enter into disapproved sexual relationships. The Lao party to the relationship may also be jailed without trial. Foreigners are not permitted to invite Lao nationals of the opposite sex to their hotel rooms; police may raid hotel rooms without notice or consent.
Foreign citizens intending to marry Lao nationals are required by Lao law to obtain prior permission from the Lao Government. The formal application process can take as long as a year. American citizens may obtain information about these requirements from the U.S. Embassy in Vientiane. The Lao Government will not issue a marriage certificate unless the correct procedures are followed. Any attempt to circumvent Lao regulations may result in arrest, imprisonment, a fine of $500-$5000, and deportation. Foreigners who cohabit with or enter into a close relationship with Lao nationals may be accused by Lao authorities of entering an illegal marriage and be subject to the same penalties.
Foreign citizens who wish to become engaged to a Lao national are required to obtain prior permission from the chief of the village where the Lao national resides. Failure to obtain prior permission can result in a fine of $500-$5000. Lao police frequently impose large fines on foreign citizens a few days after they hold an engagement ceremony with a Lao citizen based on the suspicion that the couple probably subsequently had sexual relations out of wedlock.
RELATIONSHIPS WITH LAO CITIZENS: The Lao Government prohibits sexual contact between foreign citizens and Lao nationals except when the two parties have been married in accordance with Lao Family Law. Any foreigner who enters into a sexual relationship with a Lao national may be interrogated, detained, arrested, or jailed. Lao police have confiscated passports and imposed fines of up to $5000 on foreigners who enter into disapproved sexual relationships. The Lao party to the relationship may also be jailed without trial. Foreigners are not permitted to invite Lao nationals of the opposite sex to their hotel rooms; police may raid hotel rooms without notice or consent.
Foreign citizens intending to marry Lao nationals are required by Lao law to obtain prior permission from the Lao Government. The formal application process can take as long as a year. American citizens may obtain information about these requirements from the U.S. Embassy in Vientiane. The Lao Government will not issue a marriage certificate unless the correct procedures are followed. Any attempt to circumvent Lao regulations may result in arrest, imprisonment, a fine of $500-$5000, and deportation. Foreigners who cohabit with or enter into a close relationship with Lao nationals may be accused by Lao authorities of entering an illegal marriage and be subject to the same penalties.
Foreign citizens who wish to become engaged to a Lao national are required to obtain prior permission from the chief of the village where the Lao national resides. Failure to obtain prior permission can result in a fine of $500-$5000. Lao police frequently impose large fines on foreign citizens a few days after they hold an engagement ceremony with a Lao citizen based on the suspicion that the couple probably subsequently had sexual relations out of wedlock.
Dave
Yep, they sure are cute little critters but, there can be some very heavy prices to be paid. I know one guy who thought he was married according to Lao Law, thought being the key word, some village guy performed the wedding for some Kip. But not by lao law, cost deprotation for five years.
Answer come to Thialand and wait it out, which he did, however he already had sit up a rubber plantation with the family. He was lucky they didn't sell him out.
Answer come to Thialand and wait it out, which he did, however he already had sit up a rubber plantation with the family. He was lucky they didn't sell him out.
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arjay
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You maybe interested to hear about my friend and his Laos GF, who planned to get married.
It came to pass that, the actual (lengthy) official documentation was for an engagement, but he was TOLD that the ceremony would be for a wedding, and that the family, guests etc, all considered it to be a wedding and them then to be married. His GF and family were quite open and honest about it. Though knowledgeable Laos people have since told him that the 'engagement ceremony" is very similar to the "wedding ceremony". So how would he know? Who knows!
The guests included the village headman and colleagues, and a local policeman. The bride and groom openly spent the next two nights together in the hotel where the ceremony took place, before they returned to Thailand, all I would add, without incident.
So clearly they aren't legally married, though they and the family consider them to be married?!
At the time a modest dowry was paid over, which maybe was one of the more important things for the family! He subsequently got the legal documentation translated (in Thailand), which confirmed it was officially an "engagement". It was interesting to note that the documentation imposed a condition that if she subsequently withdrew from the commitment to marry, the dowry would have to be returned to him!!
Oh, and maybe I should add, he has been told that to proceed with the legal marriage/documentation, the authorities require US$1300, for which they will take care of everything, - all paperwork/documentation, medical certificates, declarations etc., and that nothing else would then be required. Though he has heard rumours/stories that maybe after he has paid over that money, further additional costs may arise along the way.
So he is currently living happily, in limbo, in Thailand.
It came to pass that, the actual (lengthy) official documentation was for an engagement, but he was TOLD that the ceremony would be for a wedding, and that the family, guests etc, all considered it to be a wedding and them then to be married. His GF and family were quite open and honest about it. Though knowledgeable Laos people have since told him that the 'engagement ceremony" is very similar to the "wedding ceremony". So how would he know? Who knows!
The guests included the village headman and colleagues, and a local policeman. The bride and groom openly spent the next two nights together in the hotel where the ceremony took place, before they returned to Thailand, all I would add, without incident.
So clearly they aren't legally married, though they and the family consider them to be married?!
At the time a modest dowry was paid over, which maybe was one of the more important things for the family! He subsequently got the legal documentation translated (in Thailand), which confirmed it was officially an "engagement". It was interesting to note that the documentation imposed a condition that if she subsequently withdrew from the commitment to marry, the dowry would have to be returned to him!!
Oh, and maybe I should add, he has been told that to proceed with the legal marriage/documentation, the authorities require US$1300, for which they will take care of everything, - all paperwork/documentation, medical certificates, declarations etc., and that nothing else would then be required. Though he has heard rumours/stories that maybe after he has paid over that money, further additional costs may arise along the way.
So he is currently living happily, in limbo, in Thailand.
marriage in Laos
The quote above of $1300 to "get married" of course is pure graft to grease the skids. Another scam the Lao authorities use is when a couple do the application by the book is to interview/interrogate each one separately during the application process. Each one is grilled, with the Lao official hoping that one of the couple will admit to premarital sex whereupon the Lao official will levy a "fine" of $500-several thousand dollars. So, the rule is, deny, deny, deny.. They don't seem to care if the Lao member of the couple is "connected" to someone in government. A couple I knew had been engaged in a large ceremony with some quite high muckety-mucks from the Lao gov't in attendance but both still got the grilling during their interview process...
Dave