TAX on Income from Abroad

[Barney]

https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outl ... reserved=0

[sometimewoodworker]

https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outl ... reserved=0

You should note that the proposal is in the drafting stage, the British chamber of commerce and the American chamber of commerce will be meeting with the TRD and making suggestions. While there will probably be new legislation those who have already had meetings with the TRD are sure that the earliest possible date for a change is tax year 2027

[Doodoo]

Some of the richest countries in the world such as Monaco, UAE, Qatar, Grand Cayman Islands are so successful. People ask why? The only answer I have is, The Lack of taxes.
They look to other sources of income and do quite well

[Laan Yaa Mo]

Some of the richest countries in the world such as Monaco, UAE, Qatar, Grand Cayman Islands are so successful. People ask why? The only answer I have is, The Lack of taxes.
They look to other sources of income and do quite well

Since when did the Grand Cayman Islands become a country, Doodoo? Is it not a British Overseas Territory?

Don't be shy about using fact check and Bing to avoid embarrassing errors.

Hope this helps.

[Doodoo]

Embarrassment is not staying subject (Tax on Income from Abroad) as some contributors do.
Also, errors are to be looked at as part of the learning curve. Were it not then, we as a humans would never progress. But if some trys and use them as a way to embarrass others, they are the ones who should be embarrassed

Thanks Lolo

[newtovillagelife]

If you bring in a lump sum of cash in a year that you are not a tax resident, and then just live off those funds as a tax resident for a few years, would you be liable for any tax?

[sometimewoodworker]

If you bring in a lump sum of cash in a year that you are not a tax resident, and then just live off those funds as a tax resident for a few years, would you be liable for any tax?

Just because you are not tax resident doesn’t exempt you from paying tax on something remitted during that year. This is a statement directly from the TRD.
It is not a situation for most countries and one of the big partners of one of the big 4 challenged it and was explicitly told that it was the current rule/law.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Thai taxation!

The answer to your question is you haven’t given enough information for anyone, including the TRD, to give you a definitive answer. So yes, no, maybe.

[newtovillagelife]

If you bring in a lump sum of cash in a year that you are not a tax resident, and then just live off those funds as a tax resident for a few years, would you be liable for any tax?

Just because you are not tax resident doesn’t exempt you from paying tax on something remitted during that year. This is a statement directly from the TRD.
It is not a situation for most countries and one of the big partners of one of the big 4 challenged it and was explicitly told that it was the current rule/law.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Thai taxation!

The answer to your question is you haven’t given enough information for anyone, including the TRD, to give you a definitive answer. So yes, no, maybe.

Brought in lump sum, from previous years savings in 2023. Tax resident 2024, zero remittance. Will I owe any taxes for 2024.

[sometimewoodworker]

If you bring in a lump sum of cash in a year that you are not a tax resident, and then just live off those funds as a tax resident for a few years, would you be liable for any tax?

Just because you are not tax resident doesn’t exempt you from paying tax on something remitted during that year. This is a statement directly from the TRD.
It is not a situation for most countries and one of the big partners of one of the big 4 challenged it and was explicitly told that it was the current rule/law.

Welcome to the wonderful world of Thai taxation!

The answer to your question is you haven’t given enough information for anyone, including the TRD, to give you a definitive answer. So yes, no, maybe.

Brought in lump sum, from previous years savings in 2023. Tax resident 2024, zero remittance. Will I owe any taxes for 2024.

If you have remitted all funds in 2024 that were accrued before 1/1/2024 there is no assessable income.

However going forward you need to keep all funds accrued before 1/1/2024 separate from funds accrued after 1/1/2024

Whenever you bring in pre 1/1/2024 money it is not assessable

If you commingle pre and post 1/1/2024 money you are setting yourself up for a possible conversion with the TRD that may make a barbed wire enema feel good.

Also what you consider savings is rather different than what the TRD does.
So using the term savings to describe remitted money is a very bad idea.
It is either assessable income or non assessable income in the view of the TRD

All money in your possession up to 1/1/2024 is non assessable.

It was for this exact reason that I bed and breakfasted my investments just prior to 1/1/2024

[FrazeeDK]

and the tax treaties between Thailand oand nearly 70 countries? I don't think they've figured that out yet.

[tamada]

and the tax treaties between Thailand oand nearly 70 countries? I don't think they've figured that out yet.

I think a lot of people that talk about tax treaties still haven't figured out how they work either.

[Barney]

Why is life so confusing for some

Double Tax Agreement (DTA)
This agreement exempts any individual residing in Thailand and the country where Thailand has signed the agreement with from paying income taxes on both countries. To clarify, an individual can pay income taxes in the country where the individual is currently residing. The DTA has several purposes regarding income tax:

Prevent double taxation for reducing financial burdens among individuals.
Avoid conflicts on taxing rights ensuring income is taxed once or at a reduced rate.
Ensure fair treatment on taxation from discrimination.
Prevent tax evasion and fraud by sharing information with the contractual party.
Promote economic activity in stimulating cross-border transactions and investments between the treaty countries.
As of 9th October 2023, Thailand has signed the DTA with 61 countries. Nevertheless, the individual may be subject to double taxation in Thailand and the country where Thailand is not a contractual party to the DTA.

Armenia Australia Austria
Bahrain Bangladesh Belarus
Belgium Bulgaria Cambodia
Canada Chile China (People’s Republic)
Cyprus Czechia Denmark
Estonia Finland France
Germany Hong Kong Hungary
India Indonesia Ireland
Israel Italy Japan
Korea Kuwait Laos
Luxembourg Malaysia Mauritius
Nepal Netherlands New Zealand
Norway Oman Pakistan
Philippines Poland Romania
Russia Seychelles Singapore
Slovenia South Africa Spain
Sri Lanka Sweden Switzerland
Taiwan Tajikistan Turkey (Turkiye)
Ukraine United Arab Emirates United Kingdom
United States of America Uzbekistan Vietnam

Tax laws are often complex and subject to change, and it’s crucial to stay informed about these developments, especially when they can significantly impact your financial planning and obligations. Please consult with qualified tax professionals for personalized advice and to ensure compliance with the latest regulations. Remember, staying informed and seeking expert guidance are key steps in effectively managing your financial responsibilities, both domestically and abroad.

[sometimewoodworker]

Why is life so confusing for some

Double Tax Agreement (DTA)

This agreement exempts any individual residing in Thailand and the country where Thailand has signed the agreement with from paying income taxes on both countries. To clarify, an individual can pay income taxes in the country where the individual is currently residing. The DTA has several purposes regarding income tax:

I am sorry to correct you, however there is nothing in any DTA/DTC that stops you from pay income (or other taxes) in both countries apart from a few well defined classes.

One of the purposes of the DTAs/DTCs is to decide which country has exclusive taxation rights to classes of income.
For the British this stops Thailand from taxing government service pensions for the majority of recipients (note state pensions are not government service pensions)


However the point that is of most interest to the majority is that the Agreements/Conventions allow the tax paid in country A to be credited agains the tax due in country B
The practical effect is that for the British expat there is a small range of income remitted to Thailand where you have a tax liability in both Thailand and the U.K.

The reason for the confusion is that virtually every expat has a unique set of allowances dependent on their income and personal situation in Thailand. So without full knowledge of personal information it is impossible to say if, and how much, tax is due.

No only that but the letter of Thai tax law requires a tax return for those who will pay no tax.
However the TRD officials do not want (many will refuse to accept) tax returns if there is no refund or tax due. Moreover they will often refuse to issue a TIN

The net effect is that it is remarkably easy to understand why life is so confusing for many.
For example the visa/extension rules are simple compared to the taxation rules and many get them confused

[Declan MacPherson]

This should be very encouraging for many expats.

26. The Thai tax system contains a series of Allowances, Deductions and Exemptions that will help you reduce your tax bill and they are very generous. It is easily possible for the average expat foreign retiree to reduce their taxable income by 500,000 baht or more each year. For example, a retiree aged 65 years of age, married and living here full time, supporting a Thai wife who has no income and doesn’t file tax return, is allowed the following:

a. Personal Allowance for self - 60,000
b. Personal Allowance for wife - 60,000
c. Over age 65 years exemption - 190,000
d. 50% of pension income received, up to 100k - 100,000
e. In addition, the first 150,000 of assessable income is zero rated and free of tax

Asean Now
https://aseannow.com/topic/1316348-a-si ... -thailand/

[tamada]

https://www.rd.go.th/english/6045.html

This "horse's mouth" interlude brought to you by...

[Barney]

Why is life so confusing for some

Double Tax Agreement (DTA)

This agreement exempts any individual residing in Thailand and the country where Thailand has signed the agreement with from paying income taxes on both countries. To clarify, an individual can pay income taxes in the country where the individual is currently residing. The DTA has several purposes regarding income tax:

I am sorry to correct you, however there is nothing in any DTA/DTC that stops you from pay income (or other taxes) in both countries apart from a few well defined classes.

One of the purposes of the DTAs/DTCs is to decide which country has exclusive taxation rights to classes of income.
For the British this stops Thailand from taxing government service pensions for the majority of recipients (note state pensions are not government service pensions)


However the point that is of most interest to the majority is that the Agreements/Conventions allow the tax paid in country A to be credited agains the tax due in country B
The practical effect is that for the British expat there is a small range of income remitted to Thailand where you have a tax liability in both Thailand and the U.K.

The reason for the confusion is that virtually every expat has a unique set of allowances dependent on their income and personal situation in Thailand. So without full knowledge of personal information it is impossible to say if, and how much, tax is due.

No only that but the letter of Thai tax law requires a tax return for those who will pay no tax.
However the TRD officials do not want (many will refuse to accept) tax returns if there is no refund or tax due. Moreover they will often refuse to issue a TIN

The net effect is that it is remarkably easy to understand why life is so confusing for many.
For example the visa/extension rules are simple compared to the taxation rules and many get them confused

Correction not required for myself, especially a 500 word reply.
Again some make thing so hard and confusing for themselves.
One only has the read the bold print in my post to see a way forward.

[jackspratt]

https://www.rd.go.th/english/6045.html

This "horse's mouth" interlude brought to you by...

Given that the "horse" in this case was foaled 4 years ago, I am happy to go with what the major tax advisors are advising, plus a more recent example from the TRD.


https://taxsummaries.pwc.com/thailand/i ... ermination
https://sherrings.com/personal-tax-dedu ... iland.html
https://www.forvismazars.com/th/en/insi ... income-tax
https://www.rd.go.th/fileadmin/download ... uide91.pdf

[glalt]

I think the Thai tax plan is being reconsidered by the Thai government. It has backfired. Some retirees are leaving and others have changed their plans of retiring here in Thailand. Retirees all spend a lot of money here and pay the VAT. That is a big part of government budget.

[Declan MacPherson]

I think the Thai tax plan is being reconsidered by the Thai government. It has backfired. Some retirees are leaving and others have changed their plans of retiring here in Thailand. Retirees all spend a lot of money here and pay the VAT. That is a big part of government budget.

I agree with your views regarding our spending levels and tourism; but I'm not sure the powers making the rules are seeing it. I hope I'm wrong.

I would be curious to know just how much foreigners spend here annually.

You would think that they would have measured the result of this taxation and how it will affect Thai families with a husband/father possessing a foreigner pension. They make exceptions for the Visa requirements for those who support Thai families, but so far there doesn't seem to be any consideration for that with the new tax code.

[glalt]

I think the purpose of the tax fiasco is to control money laundering. While doing this, they have spotlighted the low hanging fruit. More thought should have been given to the amount remitted. I doubt that most retirees remit more than a million baht a year. That first million should be exempt. Also one property such as a condo purchase per retiree should also be exempt.